Batman : Arkham City [Day 4] And we're back

[betiko]

vodean's post just up here is the last one he wrote on the entire site, so less suspicious than i thought. glad to see rishaed finds spiesr fishy as well!

[vodean]

Silence has more value then foolish posts.

I'd rather people to post foolish posts than not posting at all.

id appreciate it if people didnt make posts that are scummy beyond their meta

I would appreciate it if scum made scummy posts as often as possible, oh right, thanks vodean!
Apart from my other reasons for thinking vodean is suspicious (Read back if you forgot...) I really think his last few posts alone are good for a vote, see it unfold in chronological order

it is true that i didnt visit anyone, however im not sure that i want to believe his claim even now... a no visit would be quite likely N1, im guessing. CM5 would not really be able to accurately fake that claim, unless he and nag are coordinating (scumbuddies, etc.). im leaving my vote, and FOSing ghostly for trying to distract us with the following:

* ghostly's big post against Nendreel, see here if interested http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 3#p3903802

Ghostly, HOW DARE YOU MAKE CASES!?
this is saying, ghostly, dont present this case right now, and i dont see it as having much merit

im believing gilli's claim less and less. i realize that he is inactive for a reason right now, but its just poor timing. also, the odds of there being two trackers is incredibly low. im not sure, but i think we might want to kill him to be sure... that sounds really scummy, but im exhausted and dont have the mental energy to put it nicely. otherwise, we need to move on to another case for today. anyone have one?

WHY WON'T ANYONE POST A CASE? oh wait, I'm still voting for spiesr, aren't I? And I fosed ghostly one page ago.... for posting a huge case, oh well, I don't see anything, let's just kill gillipig... not true at all, considering my vote isnt even on gillipig. im not believing gilli, but dont want him lynched today. what you guys have been saying about wanting to test the trackers, i have said all along.

So, I haven't weighed in for a while now, so I will drop by and post again. I am still in favor of lynching Gillipig today, and nothing that has been mentioned since then really changes anything. We also seem to be stalling out here, so maybe we need to just get it over with already?

Hey lord voldemort, what is the status of replacing Illiad and doing whatever with the other inactives?

scummariner. and hypocrite?

It is extremely hypocritical that someone who hasn't posted in 4 whole days wants someone who hasn't posted in three weeks replaced.i dont want anyone replaced... i am just pointing out something that the target of my pressure has said.


Vote Vodean

I think we need to look at the people who jumped on the bandwagon without waiting to hear a defense, and without giving appropriate reasons.

what im saying is that there is really nothing in the case. you guys need to stop skimming. read the red text

[/]

this is saying, ghostly, dont present this case right now, and i dont see it as having much merit
What was wrong with posting the case at that particular time in your opinion?

not true at all, considering my vote isnt even on gillipig. im not believing gilli, but dont want him lynched today. what you guys have been saying about wanting to test the trackers, i have said all along.

.... You specifically said

i think we might want to kill him to be sure...

I don't see any way to interperate that as not wanting him lynched

i dont want anyone replaced... i am just pointing out something that the target of my pressure has said.[/color]

could you explain what was hypocritical about the post then?

[vodean]

this is saying, ghostly, dont present this case right now, and i dont see it as having much merit
What was wrong with posting the case at that particular time in your opinion?

not true at all, considering my vote isnt even on gillipig. im not believing gilli, but dont want him lynched today. what you guys have been saying about wanting to test the trackers, i have said all along.

.... You specifically said

i think we might want to kill him to be sure...

I don't see any way to interperate that as not wanting him lynched

i dont want anyone replaced... i am just pointing out something that the target of my pressure has said.[/color]

could you explain what was hypocritical about the post then?

im not sure i follow... what are you doing with the colors? could you elaborate? my post? in the red parts?

[/]

sorry, I messed up the quotes slightly, I was commenting on your rebuttals

this is saying, ghostly, dont present this case right now, and i dont see it as having much merit

What was wrong with posting the case at that particular time in your opinion? You asked for cases hardly a page later.

not true at all, considering my vote isnt even on gillipig. im not believing gilli, but dont want him lynched today. what you guys have been saying about wanting to test the trackers, i have said all along.

.... You specifically said

i think we might want to kill him to be sure...

I don't see any way to interperate that as not wanting him lynched.

i dont want anyone replaced... i am just pointing out something that the target of my pressure has said.

Could you explain what was hypocritical about the post then?

[spiesr]

Plus im almost sure that there is a high chance that Gilli is a 3rd Party tracker, if he's telling the truth (we'll find out tommorow).

If he is a third party why hasn't he made it explicit? If he was a sort of third party that could coexist with the town (as in having a win condition that doesn't conflict with the town win condition) there would be no reason for him not to have mentioned it. Since he hasn't I am left to assume that one of two things must be true. Either he is telling the truth, which I doubt, or he is some sort of anti-town role.

what im saying is that there is really nothing in the case. you guys need to stop skimming. read the red text

And what all the people voting for you appear to be saying is that this isn't sufficient. More is needed from you. If you can't, quickly, make your next post have a more thorough and convincing response you are probably going to have to claim.

Because of Speisr we've already outed 1 confirmed tracker, 1 claimed tracker, a busdriver, 1 (claimed by speisr) bomb (I believe betiko though), + nag with an unknown night role.

I don't think naming me as a primary cause of all of that is truly an accurate representation of events. For starters Crazy revealed himself because he thought he had found evidence that Betiko was lying, and what he initially said on the matter was enough to make his role obvious. The bit about nagerous is a direct result of that, and I am of the opinion that knowing that nagerous has a night action doesn't make much a of difference in a power heavy game like this one. For the others you are at least correct that I was involved in the chain of events that led to those claims. You can disagree with who or why I chose to pressure, but I don't know how much fault can find in the fact that I did it. People have to be pressured and cases made/pursued. This inevitably leads to people claiming. Often times those people may be innocent. This may not be an ideal strategy, but it's kind of the best one we've got. Also, I still feel that the busdriver revealing his action in that situation was the right thing to do.

All the while he's be putting pressure on others

If you wish to slow down the rate of claims/day perhaps you should consider lynching the "worst" of the claims.

while sidestepping betiko's accusations.

If there is a specific point of Betiko's that you would like me to respond to please highlight it for me.

[vodean]

sorry, I messed up the quotes slightly, I was commenting on your rebuttals

this is saying, ghostly, dont present this case right now, and i dont see it as having much merit

What was wrong with posting the case at that particular time in your opinion? You asked for cases hardly a page later.

not true at all, considering my vote isnt even on gillipig. im not believing gilli, but dont want him lynched today. what you guys have been saying about wanting to test the trackers, i have said all along.

.... You specifically said

i think we might want to kill him to be sure...

I don't see any way to interperate that as not wanting him lynched.

i dont want anyone replaced... i am just pointing out something that the target of my pressure has said.

Could you explain what was hypocritical about the post then?

i feel as though i have responded to this sufficiently. im not scum, and im not outside of my meta. im still not sure what you think i should be saying is hypocrtical... me or someone else.

spiesr, if you have other points or parts of the case, bring them up please.

[rishaed]

Plus im almost sure that there is a high chance that Gilli is a 3rd Party tracker, if he's telling the truth (we'll find out tommorow).

If he is a third party why hasn't he made it explicit? If he was a sort of third party that could coexist with the town (as in having a win condition that doesn't conflict with the town win condition) there would be no reason for him not to have mentioned it. Since he hasn't I am left to assume that one of two things must be true. Either he is telling the truth, which I doubt, or he is some sort of anti-town role.

my thoughts here are what is possible not what is explicit, as see as such he may have let the 3rd party go because as of this point 3rd party is only hypothetical because we haven't explicitly outed any and it keeps scum in the dark about that.

what im saying is that there is really nothing in the case. you guys need to stop skimming. read the red text

And what all the people voting for you appear to be saying is that this isn't sufficient. More is needed from you. If you can't, quickly, make your next post have a more thorough and convincing response you are probably going to have to claim.

Starting to rolefish/pressure again?? I really would like one more night scene to gather information from, because if hes a power role then the chances of being protected are really low. The scum already have a rich choice of targets to hit with the odds in their favor that they are going to succeed. Why add more for the night? However if you think that vodean is acting scummy, and want to keep pressuring him then I also understand why.

Because of Speisr we've already outed 1 confirmed tracker, 1 claimed tracker, a busdriver, 1 (claimed by speisr) bomb (I believe betiko though), + nag with an unknown night role.

I don't think naming me as a primary cause of all of that is truly an accurate representation of events. For starters Crazy revealed himself because he thought he had found evidence that Betiko was lying, and what he initially said on the matter was enough to make his role obvious. The bit about nagerous is a direct result of that, and I am of the opinion that knowing that nagerous has a night action doesn't make much a of difference in a power heavy game like this one. For the others you are at least correct that I was involved in the chain of events that led to those claims. You can disagree with who or why I chose to pressure, but I don't know how much fault can find in the fact that I did it. People have to be pressured and cases made/pursued. This inevitably leads to people claiming. Often times those people may be innocent. This may not be an ideal strategy, but it's kind of the best one we've got. Also, I still feel that the busdriver revealing his action in that situation was the right thing to do.

All the while he's be putting pressure on others

If you wish to slow down the rate of claims/day perhaps you should consider lynching the "worst" of the claims.

while sidestepping betiko's accusations.

If there is a specific point of Betiko's that you would like me to respond to please highlight it for me.

What you say about crazy is true, however you were directly involved in betiko's outing, (obviously unwittingly outing Crazy). The suggestion in the lynching is noted, and I am assuming indirectly the case on Vodean is what you'd like me to vote in. However i could just be twisting words.

[edocsil]

i feel as though i have responded to this sufficiently. im not scum, and im not outside of my meta. im still not sure what you think i should be saying is hypocrtical... me or someone else.

spiesr, if you have other points or parts of the case, bring them up please.

Several inconsistencies have been pointed out in your defense, and a few outright lies. Is this really a good established meta to have?

[jonty125]

Ghostly, HOW DARE YOU MAKE CASES!?
this is saying, ghostly, dont present this case right now, and i dont see it as having much merit

There is nothing wrong with posting a case, and if he posts a weak case, then well he gets lynched die using poor logic.

[spiesr]

spiesr, if you have other points or parts of the case, bring them up please.

I don't have a case against you myself. I was just trying to make you see that people are expecting more of a defense from you than what you provided. I see that it didn't work though.

The suggestion in the lynching is noted, and I am assuming indirectly the case on Vodean is what you'd like me to vote in.

Nope, it is Gillipig.

Spoiler

what im saying is that there is really nothing in the case. you guys need to stop skimming. read the red text

And what all the people voting for you appear to be saying is that this isn't sufficient. More is needed from you. If you can't, quickly, make your next post have a more thorough and convincing response you are probably going to have to claim.

Starting to rolefish/pressure again?? I really would like one more night scene to gather information from, because if hes a power role then the chances of being protected are really low. The scum already have a rich choice of targets to hit with the odds in their favor that they are going to succeed. Why add more for the night? However if you think that vodean is acting scummy, and want to keep pressuring him then I also understand why.

No, I was trying to communicate to Vodean that nature as the situation he is in, since he seems unable to see it for himself. In theory if it had worked he might have even been able to avoid claiming. It obviously failed though.

Spoiler

Plus im almost sure that there is a high chance that Gilli is a 3rd Party tracker, if he's telling the truth (we'll find out tommorow).

If he is a third party why hasn't he made it explicit? If he was a sort of third party that could coexist with the town (as in having a win condition that doesn't conflict with the town win condition) there would be no reason for him not to have mentioned it. Since he hasn't I am left to assume that one of two things must be true. Either he is telling the truth, which I doubt, or he is some sort of anti-town role.

my thoughts here are what is possible not what is explicit, as see as such he may have let the 3rd party go because as of this point 3rd party is only hypothetical because we haven't explicitly outed any and it keeps scum in the dark about that.

What town friendly third party has their agenda advanced by the scum thinking they are town?

[vodean]

Ghostly, HOW DARE YOU MAKE CASES!?
this is saying, ghostly, dont present this case right now, and i dont see it as having much merit

There is nothing wrong with posting a case, and if he posts a weak case, then well he gets lynched die using poor logic.

the timing was what i was talking about. not the case. we were at a critical point in another case, and that case seemed like it had been presented to distract our attention.

spiesr, if you have other points or parts of the case, bring them up please.

I don't have a case against you myself. I was just trying to make you see that people are expecting more of a defense from you than what you provided. I see that it didn't work though.

so despite voting me, you are saying you dont have a case against me? spiesr, it is pretty clear that you are scum, trying to lead town and push for other people's lynch. you are the main person pushing against me atm.
rishaed also seems to have brought up a case against you. please respond to it adequately, or you may be forced to claim.
see where im coming from?

[strike wolf]

Spiesr isnt voting for you

Vote Count 2.3

betiko (2)- edocsil, jak111
spiesr (2)- DRoZ, Vodean
Gillipig (3)- LSU Josh, spiesr, gregwolf121
Nendreel (1)- ghostly447
Vodean (7)- /, strike wolf, ShaggyDan, gillipig, betiko, jonty125, new guy1

Not Voting (5)- Nagerous, cm5, Mr. Squirrel Illiad, Nendreel



Prods have gone to Nagerous, Illiad, cm5 and edocsil. Consider Jak not apart of the game. Should have a replacement for him within the day.
With 20 alive it takes 11 to lynch. Deadline is currently about 80 hours or so.
@newguy1/everyone. I have links of every vote count and scene in the op. If you ever need to go back to them FOS you all for skimming

[nagerous]

Another no lynch will hurt the town and with the deadline approaching, I am not convinced by vodean's defence so far.

Therefore vote vodean

I realise this is shameless inactive coming in to place a vote but I think it is a necessity at this point to keep the vote moving.

[rishaed]

Plus im almost sure that there is a high chance that Gilli is a 3rd Party tracker, if he's telling the truth (we'll find out tommorow).

If he is a third party why hasn't he made it explicit? If he was a sort of third party that could coexist with the town (as in having a win condition that doesn't conflict with the town win condition) there would be no reason for him not to have mentioned it. Since he hasn't I am left to assume that one of two things must be true. Either he is telling the truth, which I doubt, or he is some sort of anti-town role.

[/spoiler]my thoughts here are what is possible not what is explicit, as see as such he may have let the 3rd party go because as of this point 3rd party is only hypothetical because we haven't explicitly outed any and it keeps scum in the dark about that.

What town friendly third party has their agenda advanced by the scum thinking they are town?

Good question. Honestly I wasn't thinking of that question when I was making general thoughts on the matter. I'll give it some thought until I could come up with a possible reason. However with the tracker plan in place to confirm him I'm not sure that is relevant right now. Unless you know something i don't As such following my own logic if I was Gillipeg I would have probably left out the fact that I was third party >.>. However I do consider Public Information gather'd during the day phase both helpful and hurtful at the same time. Consider the facts about Betiko. If he claimed BOMB on D1 then there would have been absolutely no chance of him being targeted by scum, however with the claim of a PR he probably brought consideration on himself as a target.

Spoiler

I am holding back on some things I know and the exact nature of my role. But it's in towns best interest for me to keep doing so.
I don't mind looking scummy to town. After all Ra's al Ghul is not the nicest of characters, but he is sided with town.
I will reveal more about my role tomorrow, but I ask of you to let us take that tomorrow and not now.

But ya know he could be straight town by this post or pro-town 3rd party. Who knows.

[Nendreel]

i feel as though i have responded to this sufficiently. im not scum, and im not outside of my meta. im still not sure what you think i should be saying is hypocrtical... me or someone else.

spiesr, if you have other points or parts of the case, bring them up please.

Several inconsistencies have been pointed out in your defense, and a few outright lies. Is this really a good established meta to have?

I'm not seeing any outright lies in Vodean's posts. Could you point out the lies for me?

[rishaed]

i feel as though i have responded to this sufficiently. im not scum, and im not outside of my meta. im still not sure what you think i should be saying is hypocrtical... me or someone else.

spiesr, if you have other points or parts of the case, bring them up please.

Several inconsistencies have been pointed out in your defense, and a few outright lies. Is this really a good established meta to have?

I'm not seeing any outright lies in Vodean's posts. Could you point out the lies for me?

honestly speaking i'm really not either, just the fact that he was hypocritical in his labeling of scummarining and being hypocritical

[betiko]

crazy and gillipig, you guys have claimed tracker; can you please confirm you are both town trackers?

[crazymilkshake5]

crazy and gillipig, you guys have claimed tracker; can you please confirm you are both town trackers?

yes, i am a town tracker.

[LSU Tiger Josh]

I still don't trust Gilli and will be leaving my vote there.

[lord voldemort]

Hunting for a replacement for illiad now. Consider him out of the game. Deadline remains the same

[vodean]

so what you are saying is that the case against me is totally flawed, and based on misleading lies, but it is still worthy of votes?
could someone please present the actual case against me? if you do, and i do not respond to your concerns adequately, i am happy to claim. beware, however, that i am working all weekend and will be minimally active.

[lord voldemort]

safariguy5 2.0 is replacing Illiad effective immediately.
Deadline remains the same

[edocsil]

not true at all, considering my vote isnt even on gillipig. im not believing gilli, but dont want him lynched today. what you guys have been saying about wanting to test the trackers, i have said all along.

.... You specifically said

i think we might want to kill him to be sure...

I don't see any way to interperate that as not wanting him lynched

Here is a lie. Notice how he tries to follow public town opinions with a bit of "historical revisionism".

so what you are saying is that the case against me is totally flawed, and based on misleading lies, but it is still worthy of votes?
could someone please present the actual case against me? if you do, and i do not respond to your concerns adequately, i am happy to claim. beware, however, that i am working all weekend and will be minimally active.

No, I am calling you a liar, comprende?

[rishaed]

Spoiler

not true at all, considering my vote isnt even on gillipig. im not believing gilli, but dont want him lynched today. what you guys have been saying about wanting to test the trackers, i have said all along.

.... You specifically said

i think we might want to kill him to be sure...

I don't see any way to interperate that as not wanting him lynched

Here is a lie. Notice how he tries to follow public town opinions with a bit of "historical revisionism".

so what you are saying is that the case against me is totally flawed, and based on misleading lies, but it is still worthy of votes?
could someone please present the actual case against me? if you do, and i do not respond to your concerns adequately, i am happy to claim. beware, however, that i am working all weekend and will be minimally active.

No, I am calling you a liar, comprende?

Well i think thats enough for me to unvotevote vodean Not like im trying to BW right now, but the case is rather convincing. Still though speisr IGMEOY.