Once Upon A Killer Mafia (14/17) A Writers Block:Endgame

[aage]

I will sheep... vote DD5.

Several reasons.

A. When you think someone is scummy, that is the best time to listen to him/her. Having a bias based on a hunch is never going to find you scum, unless you have epic hunches (like a cop result, that would be a good time to not listen).
B. I also have a manga name, that makes three of us. I hope this stays within the rules about not discussing flavor.
C. He blindly sheeps Storrs opinion for some reason. I see no reason to assume why he is town. Blind sheeping is scummy, only mafia know who is town... unless Storr is your lover? But from his attitude I doubt that.


I also have a tin foil theory concerning the lovers but I'll share that on D2, I hate posting on my phone... placing tags is so painful.

[Army of GOD]

Mine's from a manga too.

I've said that I think we should try to lynch either Zivel or dd so this is an easy choice for me: vote dd5

again, my reasoning is that I don't think ultra/virus is scum and I find it unlikely that there are 3 pairs of lovers with 0 scum, so either Zivel or dd would likely be scum.

[anamainiacks]

Really quick before I go into work:

Actually, this makes you look far worse. Because my character is from a manga. And IIRC Virus' full claim correctly, it was a Japanese name. Which would suggest it was also from a manga. So if you were just "Romeo from Romeo and Juliet", I have serious doubts about its legitimacy because that wasn't a manga, last I checked.

Yes this is part of the reason that I wanted to see if DD was claiming the Romeo and Juliet pairing because my role is also from an anime. I didn't pursue it though because it still felt a bit early to jump to the conclusion that their role did not fit flavor wise but it was part of the factor in what I thought of DD's claim.

I thought the same thing too, but a quick search on Google does return this: http://romeoxjuliet.wikia.com/wiki/Romeo_X_Juliet
So apparently, Romeo x Juliet is a manga as well, and dd's claim does fit with the manga flavour. Based on the character profiles there, however, Tybalt doesn't die (interestingly the website says "the series depicts Tybalt as a vigilante"), unlike dd's claim:

I am romeo. Juliet's cousin Tybalt accidentally died. I was banned from the town. I sneak in to see Juliet every once in a while, but only at night so I don't get caught.

Banned from the town? Wouldn't that imply that you're not town?

By my count, dd has 4 votes, which is the highest followed by AoG's 3. It's probably time for a full claim from dd.

Mod, what happens if there's a tie in votes when the deadline arrives? And we have 1 day left for D1, so we might need an extension to discuss dd's case.

[Whatsausage]

Mine is also from a manga, so it does seem suspicious that he appears to be the only one who isn't. However, I hesitate because if his character is also from a manga, and he saw the prior claim was from a manga, it would only make sense for him to try to follow suit? Maybe it really is a poor slip and his actual character was obviously a villain so he felt the need to lie. Though the more I think about it, the more this seems to be correct.
This begins to make me wonder if he is a lover at all, being as since he believes lover to die with him, you would think his lover would be trying to come out and protect/defend him. The main reason I don't believe they would is in case they aren't sure if they die and they want to hide for when/if dd comes up scum.
So I'm not quite ready to switch my vote yet, but I probably will later today.

FP'd by anama
I wondered if that could be the case, but with that inconsistency... Very suspicious

[mtamburini]

I do not claim to have anything on Zivel, as I do not.

However, I do have some rather solid evidence on dd.

• He has been incessantly pushing for me being lynched and upon us claiming, has shifted to virus to off two townies
• Seems not to care about two townies dying
• Is still voting virus after I've clarified many times that if one of us has to be lynched it should be me
• Has contributed nothing of note except empty bandwagon posts
• Has not managed to formulate an opinion of his own, always using Storr or someone else as a mouth, essentially staying safe and being able to say he wasn't leading
• Continues to divert attention every time I mention that Virus is a stupid lynch
• Seems to be unable to see anything from a townie point of view - everything must be a scumtell!
• All the reasons mentioned earlier when I first read you as scum and you responded by reading me as scum
• Apparently I'm scum because I'm now cc'd lover but Zivel is not

As for the Army of GOD situation, me and virus have no connection with him nor do we know why he's the only one trying to support us. (This must be a scumtell too dd!)
Lynch DD

Only quasi-realistic option besides you guys lynching me for the sake of offing one of us.

You honestly think he COUNTER CLAIMS NOT ONLY YOURS BUT ZIVELS AS WELL MASON LOVER CLAIMS AS SCUM, get your head out of your ass ultra think realistically what gain he has to CC.

[mtamburini]

The worst group of players I have ever played with now Im mad and have to break it down for you why DD is never scum here.

Assuming both other pairs of mason/lovers are town
1) As Scum doesnt need to CC just lynches one of the pair, then says omg the other must be mafia and lynches into the 2nd pair.
2) As town doesnt gain anything by ccing

So what you guys that are voting on DD are saying is that as scum he decided to cc 2 pairs and bring himself into the conversation ad put a potential target on his head when the conversation wouldve stayed on ultra/virus or zivel.

GET A BRAIN AND USE IT

Now sheep my AOG vote.

[TheForgivenOne]

I'm surprised none of you have heard about the R&J manga (Then again, I've worked in a book store), so that line of voting really doesn't have merit to me.

@anam, I think he means he's banned from the town Juliet is in (This is barring that his Lover partner in game isn't Juliet). If his Lover is the Juliet character, that makes completely no sense. I do get a sense at what his role may be, but I won't push at it.

@mtam Your two points do have merit, but a Scum DD could have thrown his claim of Lover out just to add more confusion to the whole situation. But your first point makes the most sense.

[mtamburini]

I'm surprised none of you have heard about the R&J manga (Then again, I've worked in a book store), so that line of voting really doesn't have merit to me.

@anam, I think he means he's banned from the town Juliet is in (This is barring that his Lover partner in game isn't Juliet). If his Lover is the Juliet character, that makes completely no sense. I do get a sense at what his role may be, but I won't push at it.

@mtam Your two points do have merit, but a Scum DD could have thrown his claim of Lover out just to add more confusion to the whole situation. But your first point makes the most sense.

If hes scum mason lover there is absolutely no reason to out himself, like 0%. Adding to confusion is not necessary based on the points ive already made.

[Army of GOD]

I'm surprised none of you have heard about the R&J manga (Then again, I've worked in a book store), so that line of voting really doesn't have merit to me.

@anam, I think he means he's banned from the town Juliet is in (This is barring that his Lover partner in game isn't Juliet). If his Lover is the Juliet character, that makes completely no sense. I do get a sense at what his role may be, but I won't push at it.

@mtam Your two points do have merit, but a Scum DD could have thrown his claim of Lover out just to add more confusion to the whole situation. But your first point makes the most sense.

If hes scum mason lover there is absolutely no reason to out himself, like 0%. Adding to confusion is not necessary based on the points ive already made.

yeah, 0%. except oh wait, now you're saying there's not a chance he's scum. So yeah, there is a good reason to out himself.

[rishaed]

Quick Mod Note:
I'll get a VC up around 8pm prolly, but would anyone know about a person willing to replace Nark? I sent a couple PM's to potential interested parties but haven't gotten a reply....

[mtamburini]

I'm surprised none of you have heard about the R&J manga (Then again, I've worked in a book store), so that line of voting really doesn't have merit to me.

@anam, I think he means he's banned from the town Juliet is in (This is barring that his Lover partner in game isn't Juliet). If his Lover is the Juliet character, that makes completely no sense. I do get a sense at what his role may be, but I won't push at it.

@mtam Your two points do have merit, but a Scum DD could have thrown his claim of Lover out just to add more confusion to the whole situation. But your first point makes the most sense.

If hes scum mason lover there is absolutely no reason to out himself, like 0%. Adding to confusion is not necessary based on the points ive already made.

yeah, 0%. except oh wait, now you're saying there's not a chance he's scum. So yeah, there is a good reason to out himself.

Great contribution to the conversation, you need to die seriously, the scum level is high for AOG LYNCH HIM

[StorrZerg]

So all those agreeing that it's odd his flavor isn't manga, seems like it can be. And pushing that as a reason, that needs revaluation.

I like mtamburini's reasons to not lynch Dd5 more than his reason on aog.

[StorrZerg]

I will sheep... vote DD5.

Several reasons.

A. When you think someone is scummy, that is the best time to listen to him/her. Having a bias based on a hunch is never going to find you scum, unless you have epic hunches (like a cop result, that would be a good time to not listen).
B. I also have a manga name, that makes three of us. I hope this stays within the rules about not discussing flavor.
C. He blindly sheeps Storrs opinion for some reason. I see no reason to assume why he is town. Blind sheeping is scummy, only mafia know who is town... unless Storr is your lover? But from his attitude I doubt that.


I also have a tin foil theory concerning the lovers but I'll share that on D2, I hate posting on my phone... placing tags is so painful.

I don't get reason A as to why it points Dd5 as scum.

Reason B doesn't hold weight.

Reason C. Did he sheep blindly? Seems to me he read, and addressed issues regarding pcm. Maybe he did sheep, but it's hardly blind or with out effort. If you still stand by reason c, I'd like you to explain more and show what you mean.

[Army of GOD]

I'm surprised none of you have heard about the R&J manga (Then again, I've worked in a book store), so that line of voting really doesn't have merit to me.

@anam, I think he means he's banned from the town Juliet is in (This is barring that his Lover partner in game isn't Juliet). If his Lover is the Juliet character, that makes completely no sense. I do get a sense at what his role may be, but I won't push at it.

@mtam Your two points do have merit, but a Scum DD could have thrown his claim of Lover out just to add more confusion to the whole situation. But your first point makes the most sense.

If hes scum mason lover there is absolutely no reason to out himself, like 0%. Adding to confusion is not necessary based on the points ive already made.

yeah, 0%. except oh wait, now you're saying there's not a chance he's scum. So yeah, there is a good reason to out himself.

Great contribution to the conversation, you need to die seriously, the scum level is high for AOG LYNCH HIM

cool story bro

[strike wolf]

I could think of a few reasons:

1. He is scum and lover is the claim he was stuck with. Not having too much experience under his belt yet, he doesnt feel comfortable trying to fake claim a different role and not saying he is a lover than is as good as saying lynch me if he comes out as a lover later..

2. Ultra/Virus are scum and DD tried to double counter claim hoping to save them

Frankly, DD doesnt bleed scum like he did in PYP but his play hasnt been that different either. Theres enough inconsitencies here to warrant a lynch.
Vote DD5
My top scum outside of DD:

Storrzerg, Mtam (I currently dont see why these two are definiyely different alignments or at least certainly not both scum because Storr has prodded him a couple of times?), AoG who is less likely to be scum if Storr/Mtam are.

As far as the Romeo and Juliet Manga seems like his is based off the Shakespearean version. Maybe splitting hairs but I am not convinced about keeping him alive even if it was the manga version.

@Storr: I get what you are saying about saving the response for tomorrow but I would hope you understand that scum or town, I am not going to sit back and let you trivialize it.

[mtamburini]

I will sheep... vote DD5.

Several reasons.

A. When you think someone is scummy, that is the best time to listen to him/her. Having a bias based on a hunch is never going to find you scum, unless you have epic hunches (like a cop result, that would be a good time to not listen).
B. I also have a manga name, that makes three of us. I hope this stays within the rules about not discussing flavor.
C. He blindly sheeps Storrs opinion for some reason. I see no reason to assume why he is town. Blind sheeping is scummy, only mafia know who is town... unless Storr is your lover? But from his attitude I doubt that.


I also have a tin foil theory concerning the lovers but I'll share that on D2, I hate posting on my phone... placing tags is so painful.

I don't get reason A as to why it points Dd5 as scum.

Reason B doesn't hold weight.

Reason C. Did he sheep blindly? Seems to me he read, and addressed issues regarding pcm. Maybe he did sheep, but it's hardly blind or with out effort. If you still stand by reason c, I'd like you to explain more and show what you mean.

Most of us have played with DD in the last game stor modded, this is nowhere near the same kind of play as he did in PYP.

I dont understand wtf is magna names

FPD strike wolf

[mtamburini]

I could think of a few reasons:

1. He is scum and lover is the claim he was stuck with. Not having too much experience under his belt yet, he doesnt feel comfortable trying to fake claim a different role and not saying he is a lover than is as good as saying lynch me if he comes out as a lover later..

2. Ultra/Virus are scum and DD tried to double counter claim hoping to save them

Frankly, DD doesnt bleed scum like he did in PYP but his play hasnt been that different either. Theres enough inconsitencies here to warrant a lynch.
Vote DD5
My top scum outside of DD:

Storrzerg, Mtam (I currently dont see why these two are definiyely different alignments or at least certainly not both scum because Storr has prodded him a couple of times?), AoG who is less likely to be scum if Storr/Mtam are.

As far as the Romeo and Juliet Manga seems like his is based off the Shakespearean version. Maybe splitting hairs but I am not convinced about keeping him alive even if it was the manga version.

@Storr: I get what you are saying about saving the response for tomorrow but I would hope you understand that scum or town, I am not going to sit back and let you trivialize it.

Point 2 is the worst thing I have ever seen, THEY WERE WILLING TO SELF SACRIFICE TO PROVE THEMSELVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THERE WAS NO REASON TO DOUBLE CC USE YOUR FUCKING HEAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mtamburini]

This late BW on DD is absolutely scummy and absurd. The fact that no one will even BW on AOG with me or even talk about him at all is even more mindblowing. Good job to the scum team this game *claps* the rest of this town doesnt use any logic.

[TheForgivenOne]

I dont understand wtf is magna names

FPD strike wolf

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=What+is+Manga%3F

I was about to post more, but got a stack of work put on my desk. I'll post later sometime.

[HotShot53]

The worst group of players I have ever played with now Im mad and have to break it down for you why DD is never scum here.

Assuming both other pairs of mason/lovers are town
1) As Scum doesnt need to CC just lynches one of the pair, then says omg the other must be mafia and lynches into the 2nd pair.
2) As town doesnt gain anything by ccing

So what you guys that are voting on DD are saying is that as scum he decided to cc 2 pairs and bring himself into the conversation ad put a potential target on his head when the conversation wouldve stayed on ultra/virus or zivel.

GET A BRAIN AND USE IT

Now sheep my AOG vote.

This is the main thing I can't understand, is why a scum DD would come out the way he did... as mtam says, by not coming out then ultra would probably be lynched, and then if he came up town (which a scum DD would know), then zivel would have pressure and might get lynched also. The only way I can see a scum zivel coming out is if ultra is also scum, and he was doing it to either A. protect ultra from an almost certain lynch or B. gain town cred if ultra did get lynched anyway. For that reason, I still think lynching ultra is a better move than zivel, because I can't imagine why a scum zivel would come out if ultra were town, but ultra could be scum with zivel being town.

The romeo claim with everyone apparently being from manga does sound funny, although apparently there is a R&J manga out there also... the tybalt discrepancy is weird though, as in the manga tybalt apparently is still alive even after romeo and juliet die. And also, in the manga it's juliet that's in hiding, romeo is fine. Any comments on this discrepancy dd?

(FP like 5 times) (And 2 more while I was reading those 5)

[mtamburini]

IF DD is lynched I am using my ability to kill myself this lynch is an absolute travesty.

FPD twice

@hotshot

Who gives a shit about the actual story thats a stretch at the very least that people are going on to get DD lynched. The story for opening scenes and closing scenes will be mroe important than the actual back stories IMO.

[Army of GOD]

so mtam is a vig..?

[pancakemix]

pcm you got a quote wrong in their, having my name isntead of dd5. (cause i certainly have not been calling ultra scum all game)

Whoops. Force of habit?

eah i think the claim is real flavor wise. not going to confirm or deny if my character is from a manga, but i'm confident if the entire game was based off manga then it would be a bit more apparent in the overall theme of the game.

We haven't really gotten much in the way of flavor up til now outside of our roles and a "storybook" opening. I'm suggesting it might be overall apparent, you refusing to confirm or deny makes it difficult to assess this theory.

Yes this is part of the reason that I wanted to see if DD was claiming the Romeo and Juliet pairing because my role is also from an anime. I didn't pursue it though because it still felt a bit early to jump to the conclusion that their role did not fit flavor wise but it was part of the factor in what I thought of DD's claim.

And this makes Storr's weak turn against it look like a veiled defense.

I thought the same thing too, but a quick search on Google does return this: http://romeoxjuliet.wikia.com/wiki/Romeo_X_Juliet
So apparently, Romeo x Juliet is a manga as well, and dd's claim does fit with the manga flavour. Based on the character profiles there, however, Tybalt doesn't die (interestingly the website says "the series depicts Tybalt as a vigilante"), unlike dd's claim:

Honestly, that's really a loophole more than anything. And isn't the Tybalt thing really what breaks it? Really, put this in perspective: his claim is actually worse than ultra's. He's got less power if he can only talk at night.

1) As Scum doesnt need to CC just lynches one of the pair, then says omg the other must be mafia and lynches into the 2nd pair.
2) As town doesnt gain anything by ccing

This kinda goes back to what I suggested earlier about virus/ultra not being "lovers" (because let's face it, their mechanics don't line up with lover mechanics) and ultra actually being scum. It's kind of a stretch, but it's worth considering. You may have picked up on that if you would actually read this game.

Quick Mod Note:
I'll get a VC up around 8pm prolly, but would anyone know about a person willing to replace Nark? I sent a couple PM's to potential interested parties but haven't gotten a reply....

Did you try DoomYoshi? He's been signing up for games of late.

I don't get reason A as to why it points Dd5 as scum.

Reason B doesn't hold weight.

Reason C. Did he sheep blindly? Seems to me he read, and addressed issues regarding pcm. Maybe he did sheep, but it's hardly blind or with out effort. If you still stand by reason c, I'd like you to explain more and show what you mean.

As I've pointed out, you can't jump to the R&J manga because it doesn't line up with DD's story, which both Anam and TFO seem to be suggesting. The existence of the manga doesn't clear his claim, and even if it did it doesn't make him town (See: question on mafia fakeclaims).

Overall, this is really weak play from you. I half expect us to be wrong about DD just so you can try to play the "told you so" card.

Holy shit the fastposts.

I think the main problem with DD coming out is why he does it at all. How do you rationalize that if he's town? It was "weird"? I think if you're thinking that a scum wouldn't do that, you're assuming perfect play, and you can't default to that, tbh.

[HotShot53]

IF DD is lynched I am using my ability to kill myself this lynch is an absolute travesty.

FPD twice

@hotshot

Who gives a shit about the actual story thats a stretch at the very least that people are going on to get DD lynched. The story for opening scenes and closing scenes will be mroe important than the actual back stories IMO.

Back story that doesn't make sense compared to anyone else's back story = he could be lying = he could be scum.

[mtamburini]

IF DD is lynched I am using my ability to kill myself this lynch is an absolute travesty.

FPD twice

@hotshot

Who gives a shit about the actual story thats a stretch at the very least that people are going on to get DD lynched. The story for opening scenes and closing scenes will be mroe important than the actual back stories IMO.

Back story that doesn't make sense compared to anyone else's back story = he could be lying = he could be scum.

You are basing your READ on a back story and not his play which is fucking retarded, you are so much better player than this.