Conquer Club

Stop complaining about taxes.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/tax ... axes_N.htm

"Federal, state and local income taxes consumed 9.2% of all personal income in 2009, the lowest rate since 1950, the Bureau of Economic Analysis reports. That rate is far below the historic average of 12% for the last half-century. The overall tax burden hit bottom in December at 8.8.% of income before rising slightly in the first three months of 2010."

The reasons?

"• Stimulus law. One-third of last year's $862 billion economic stimulus went for tax cuts. Biggest reduction: The Making Work Pay tax credit reduced income taxes $800 for married couples earning up to $150,000.

• Progressive tax rates. Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

• Sales tax. Consumers cut spending sharply in this downturn, thereby paying less in sales taxes."

ritz627 wrote:Stop complaining about taxes.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/tax ... axes_N.htm

"Federal, state and local income taxes consumed 9.2% of all personal income in 2009, the lowest rate since 1950, the Bureau of Economic Analysis reports. That rate is far below the historic average of 12% for the last half-century. The overall tax burden hit bottom in December at 8.8.% of income before rising slightly in the first three months of 2010."

The reasons?

• Progressive tax rates. Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

• Sales tax. Consumers cut spending sharply in this downturn, thereby paying less in sales taxes."

Neither of those two reasons make sense given that first paragraph.

Brough to you by

Center for American Progress!

When 50% of Americans do not pay any taxes, it's not surprising that those numbers are so low.

This is the second pre-taxhike debate article put out recently, that media in the near future will be citing as reference.

All I know is, I pay so much more than 9.2%, that I do not even want to know who actually only pays 9% or less, because I just might do like they do and quit my job...

Paying taxes is optional! Dont like it, dont work! Go Galt.

I, while still employed, figure I pay about 55% all said and done, all taxes, fees, registrations, regulations considered. Wondering, given it is state law that I purchase auto and health insurnace, what category do those go into? because that is 20% i.e., me paying for myself

my state sales tax is 6%, plus state income tax is 10%, not to mention federal about 18%, SS and medicare also kick me in the balls for another 10%. There just isn't that much left over. Business owners who provide jobs have it worse..

rockfist wrote:

ritz627 wrote:Stop complaining about taxes.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/tax ... axes_N.htm

"Federal, state and local income taxes consumed 9.2% of all personal income in 2009, the lowest rate since 1950, the Bureau of Economic Analysis reports. That rate is far below the historic average of 12% for the last half-century. The overall tax burden hit bottom in December at 8.8.% of income before rising slightly in the first three months of 2010."

The reasons?

• Progressive tax rates. Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

• Sales tax. Consumers cut spending sharply in this downturn, thereby paying less in sales taxes."

Neither of those two reasons make sense given that first paragraph.

That's a great point. As it so happens the reasons do make sense. Progressive tax rates, in the most simple of explanations, means that the poorer you are the less percentage of income you have to pay towards taxes. Per capita income taxes lower because there are many more poor and middle class people than rich people. The second bullet point is just because we are in a recession and people are spending less, so therefore less taxes are being drawn from the sale of goods within the country. Read the article if your looking for an in depth explanation b/c the bullet points come straight from it.

Night Strike wrote:When 50% of Americans do not pay any taxes, it's not surprising that those numbers are so low.

50%...wow thats quite the exaggeration. Again, this number includes sales tax, which we all pay when we buy goods.

ritz627 wrote:

Night Strike wrote:When 50% of Americans do not pay any taxes, it's not surprising that those numbers are so low.

50%...wow thats quite the exaggeration. Again, this number includes sales tax, which we all pay when we buy goods.

i think its 47%. LIAR! LIAR!!!

Ritz. what is your problem with the Tea Party?

ritz627 wrote:

rockfist wrote:

ritz627 wrote:Stop complaining about taxes.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/tax ... axes_N.htm

"Federal, state and local income taxes consumed 9.2% of all personal income in 2009,

The reasons?

• Progressive tax rates. Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

• Sales tax. Consumers cut spending sharply in this downturn, thereby paying less in sales taxes."

Paying less sales taxes will not impact the percentage of income taxes you are paying.

All personal income, that basically means we add up each and every citizens' personal income, call that X. Then add up the taxes paid by each person, call that Y. Divide Y by X and we have 9.2%. In a nation with a large standard deviation in income levels progressive tax rates actually raise the percentage not lower it.

Its a poorly worded article. And, regardless of what level Americans taxes are set at, we have the right to complain and vote against tax increases since its our money.

Especially when the entity that oversees the collection and spending of the money wastes 30% of it and uses 25% more to pay interest on previous overspending...

The situation being what it is, how is the U.S. going to address it's debt without raising taxes?
Surely economic critical mass is approaching in the next decade......and even doubling your current individual tax load won't pay the vig on that 13 trillion monster.

Are there any other ideas tabled that don't include raising taxes?


Johnny R

Johnny Rockets wrote:The situation being what it is, how is the U.S. going to address it's debt without raising taxes?
Surely economic critical mass is approaching in the next decade......and even doubling your current individual tax load won't pay the vig on that 13 trillion monster.

Are there any other ideas tabled that don't include raising taxes?


Johnny R

Yeah. Most "libertarians" in the US are actually anarchists in disguise.

ritz627 wrote:Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

Wait, I thought George W. Bush hated the poor.

Dear Liberals, please stop complaining about George W. Bush and tax cuts!

DangerBoy wrote:

ritz627 wrote:Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

Wait, I thought George W. Bush hated the poor.

Dear Liberals, please stop complaining about George W. Bush and tax cuts!

But the economy turned out so well!

Iliad wrote:

DangerBoy wrote:

ritz627 wrote:Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

Wait, I thought George W. Bush hated the poor.

Dear Liberals, please stop complaining about George W. Bush and tax cuts!

But the economy turned out so well!

Yes, it did. 52 straight weeks of job growth and steady expansion from 2003 - 2007. But let's assume you're right. Then maybe we should have raised taxes on the poor and we wouldn't be in this mess.

Johnny Rockets wrote:The situation being what it is, how is the U.S. going to address it's debt without raising taxes?
Surely economic critical mass is approaching in the next decade......and even doubling your current individual tax load won't pay the vig on that 13 trillion monster.

Are there any other ideas tabled that don't include raising taxes?


Johnny R

It's still legal to cut government programs.

DangerBoy wrote:

ritz627 wrote:Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

Wait, I thought George W. Bush hated the poor.

No that's black people.

rockfist wrote:

ritz627 wrote:

rockfist wrote:

ritz627 wrote:Stop complaining about taxes.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/tax ... axes_N.htm

"Federal, state and local income taxes consumed 9.2% of all personal income in 2009,

The reasons?

• Progressive tax rates. Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

• Sales tax. Consumers cut spending sharply in this downturn, thereby paying less in sales taxes."

Paying less sales taxes will not impact the percentage of income taxes you are paying.

All personal income, that basically means we add up each and every citizens' personal income, call that X. Then add up the taxes paid by each person, call that Y. Divide Y by X and we have 9.2%. In a nation with a large standard deviation in income levels progressive tax rates actually raise the percentage not lower it.

Its a poorly worded article. And, regardless of what level Americans taxes are set at, we have the right to complain and vote against tax increases since its our money.

Ah good call, I didnt see that. I guess the sales tax thing kinda doesn't make sense with regard to that particular sentence, haha. Overall tough, the article discusses "total taxes as a percentage of personal income," which the reasons do pertain to.

Phatscotty wrote:Ritz. what is your problem with the Tea Party?

Well, i guess if i had to put it simply...the many tea party members are not politically educated, and are just pissed off because the economy isn't doing well and they need something to yell about. They don't know what they are talking about, and get their information from the likes of Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck, and their almighty leader Sarah Palin. Sarah Palin is f***ing retarded and everyone knows it. It's embarrassing. They are far, far to the right, and I am far to the left.

ritz627 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Ritz. what is your problem with the Tea Party?

Well, i guess if i had to put it simply...the many tea party members are not politically educated, and are just pissed off because the economy isn't doing well and they need something to yell about. They don't know what they are talking about, and get their information from the likes of Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck, and their almighty leader Sarah Palin. Sarah Palin is f***ing retarded and everyone knows it. It's embarrassing. They are far, far to the right, and I am far to the left.

I completely disagree with almost all of that. Where did you get that information?

how do you know the "tea party's" education level? what is the avereage democrat voters education level while your at it??? ???
how do you know what they are pissed off about?

I am familiar with the tea party platform. you covered the party with about the broadest stroke possible. care to begin getting specific?

Why do you think you are far to the left? Are you far to the left on everything or just on some issues? What things are important to you?

ritz627 wrote:I am far to the left.

You're far out there, that's for sure

So far to the left, you come blazing out into the forum with generalities and prejudice name calling and insulting an entire peoples intelligence levels without even knowing them or ever met any of them? not to mention mischaracterize (badly) their leaders and principles!?!

Far left is sounding smart and cool

ritz627 wrote:

rockfist wrote:

ritz627 wrote:

rockfist wrote:

ritz627 wrote:Stop complaining about taxes.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/tax ... axes_N.htm

"Federal, state and local income taxes consumed 9.2% of all personal income in 2009,

The reasons?

• Progressive tax rates. Presidents Clinton and Bush pushed through a series of tax changes — credits, lower rates, higher exemptions — that slashed income taxes for poor and middle-class families. A drop in income now can trigger big tax breaks and sharply lower rates, sometimes falling to zero.

• Sales tax. Consumers cut spending sharply in this downturn, thereby paying less in sales taxes."

Paying less sales taxes will not impact the percentage of income taxes you are paying.

All personal income, that basically means we add up each and every citizens' personal income, call that X. Then add up the taxes paid by each person, call that Y. Divide Y by X and we have 9.2%. In a nation with a large standard deviation in income levels progressive tax rates actually raise the percentage not lower it.

Its a poorly worded article. And, regardless of what level Americans taxes are set at, we have the right to complain and vote against tax increases since its our money.

Ah good call, I didnt see that. I guess the sales tax thing kinda doesn't make sense with regard to that particular sentence, haha. Overall tough, the article discusses "total taxes as a percentage of personal income," which the reasons do pertain to.

really.....hmmmm