Baltic Crusades

[thenobodies80]

Map Name:Baltic Crusades
Mapmaker(s):

Concept - thebastard
Graphics - thenobodies80
XML - ender516

Number of Territories:59
Special Features:Starting Neutrals, Auto-Deploy

Map Image:
Big Version:

Click image to enlarge.

Small Version:

Click image to enlarge.

XML:
http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/download/file.php?id=1116


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show: old versions

[natty dread]

Post images like this:

Code: Select all

[BigImg]url of image[/BigImg]


So it will show on your post like this:

Click image to enlarge.

[theBastard]

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[Industrial Helix]

I think its interesting but you need to present what the gameplay is going to be. I see ships and shields but none of it is explained.

[theBastard]

....

[natty dread]

My first advice to you is: get a good graphics software and learn how to use it. Alternatively, try to get some graphical artist to work with you on this project.

Good graphics softwares include Paint shop, GIMP and Paint.Net. The last two are free.

The next thing is, you have a lot of unused space in the lower left corner. Are you going to put the legend there?

[theBastard]

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[theBastard]

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[Industrial Helix]

Well, this version is an improvement I think. It looks intriguing and you have my support, but there are some problems with this map.

You're legend ought to be boxed it, It's difficult to read. Same for the minmap legend in the other corner which is near impossible to read.

What graphics program are you using?

And for your bonus woes... There are bonus calculators.

viewtopic.php?f=466&t=1410

[theBastard]

,,,,

[theBastard]

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[Industrial Helix]

ok... You are using layers in photoshop right? If not... you're in trouble.

Take a look at the Hungary thread, linked here: viewtopic.php?f=63&t=108937&start=15

There's a lot of good discussion about how to work in layers and make your borders and colors seem smooth. Before you press on, I think you need a presentable image.

The first thing to do is fix those rough borders.

Create a new layer and label it borders.
Zoom in to about %600.
Select the brush tool, black color and size 3 px.
Systematically trace over the borders. It doesn't have to be exact but close will do. You will ultimately be deleting your original image, so don't worry about it.

Once you've done that create a new layer and label it rivers.
Do the exact same as the above with a bluish color of your choice.
Trace over the rivers.

One of the big problems with this map, imo, is that the tri-colors of the empires contrast with each other too much. Make the Ottoman Empire various shades of red, make the Austrian's various shades of white, make Hungary shades of Green. (or colors of your choice). That way the regions have some sort of graphical unity.

Next, you're going to want to apply these colors...

Create a new Layer and label it Ottoman Hungary.
Get your brush tool and change the color to something like burgundy.
Increase the size of the brush to about 20.
Color in the regions that comprise Ottoman Hungary.
Shrink the brush to maybe a 5 px and get in the little nooks and crannies of the border.
When you're done you should have a much clearer map of Ottoman Hungary.

Repeat the above step for all your regions, including the sea. When you're done, you'll have a better looking map.

But obviously label the territories whatever it is that you want to label them. Ottoman Hungary probably isn't appropriate here

While I suggested you fix the legend before, I'm going to say lets hold on that a second. When you make the borders you're going to learn the basics of the brush to help make those legends look nice. So yeah, fix the borders and the colors. Skip the dots for now, you'll add those on another layer later.

Make sure you're resolution is 72 and that you're working on the large map (I usually go 800 x 800 pixels for this size).

Regarding your legend, don't mess around with anything complex on that just yet. Box it in and here's how.

Go to the shape icon and hold it down so you get a choice menu, select box.
Create a new layer that is higher on the list than all your other layers, name it "Legend".
Draw a box around your legend information.
Select the Brush tool and make sure your size is 3 px and that your foreground color is black and background color is white.
Select the Pen tool (right next to the shape tool) and move up to the top menu. To your left there are 3 boxes with pen tool diagrams on them, select the middle one. Go down to the box you drew and right click on it.
Select "Stroke Path" and this will bring up a menu, make sure brush is selected and hit ok.
Viola, you have a box. Now right click the box again and select "Fill shape." Make sure in the next menu the background color is selected and hit ok.
Finally, right click again on the box and select delete path.

You're text should be gone now but that's ok. Go over to your layer menu and select the folder icon (at the bottom, third button on the left, looks like a little folder) Name your folder "Legend Text." and put all text that is in your legend in it (standard drag and drop).
Once you've done that move the folder above the "Legend" folder and you're text should be back.
Repeat the same for your legend graphics.

It seems like a lot to do, but it's not really. Maybe an hour of your time and you're map will be better for it. Once you've got smooth borders and your land colors don't fade next to the borders, you'll be in good shape. We'll hit your minimap next once you get your borders and colors right.

[theBastard]

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[theBastard]

maybe stupid question, but which one is "shape icon"? I can not find it...

[Industrial Helix]

maybe stupid question, but which one is "shape icon"? I can not find it...

Not stupid question... Here you go:

Another thing, make sure your border layer is on top of your colors layer cause it looks like some of the colors are overlapping the border.

Click image to enlarge.

What exactly is your plan for giant ole Sweden? Cause If it's not there for gameplay I'd suggest ditching it and putting your legend there. Plus it looks way too big, but that might be me.

Lastly, make sure that there are no area where the borders and the colors do not meet. I can see a thin line between the border and the Burgundy red color up there. It's present elsewhere so give you map a look over for things like that. Otherwise, big improvement and nice work!

[theBastard]

Another thing, make sure your border layer is on top of your colors layer cause it looks like some of the colors are overlapping the border.

ou, I did not have border layer on the top of list of layers... so I will do it again.

What exactly is your plan for giant ole Sweden? Cause If it's not there for gameplay I'd suggest ditching it and putting your legend there. Plus it looks way too big, but that might be me.

Sweden will be not in game. than yes delete it sounds good.

Lastly, make sure that there are no area where the borders and the colors do not meet. I can see a thin line between the border and the Burgundy red color up there. It's present elsewhere so give you map a look over for things like that.

o.k. it is because I did bot have border layer on the top of layer list and the regional colours superimpose borders. so I did not want go too close...

Otherwise, big improvement and nice work!

thanks.

about Photoshop and shape tool. what version of Photoshop you have? I have CS2 and there are only:
Rectangle Tool
Rounded Rectangle Tool
Elipse Tool
Polygon Tool
Line Tool
Custom Shape Tool

[Industrial Helix]

I'm running with cs2 and you have what I'm talking about. You want the Rectangle shape. Though you can make your own with a series of lines, which might work well for the minimap.

It sounds like you're about to redraw your border... just drag the layer on top of the color files don't redraw it. Also, you got to get right underneath the border with the color... the border should cover the division just fine. You might have to touch the borders up though with a little brush and eraser... make sure you're on the right layer!!!!

Also, I dunno if you're using mac or not, but ctrl+apple+mouse click key is great for identifying a layer... it's probably something like ctrl+alt or soemthing for windows though.

[theBastard]

is this what you mean? a

Click image to enlarge.

[theBastard]

or this?

Click image to enlarge.

[skeletonboy]

How big is the image? It looks bigger than the 800x840 pxl size restriction and if it is it's easier to resize it sooner rather than later.

[theBastard]

How big is the image? It looks bigger than the 800x840 pxl size restriction and if it is it's easier to resize it sooner rather than later.

it´s 840 x 800 pixels.

when we spoke about size, could has image size 800 x 840 pixels, too?

[natty dread]

No, 840x800 is the maximum size. 800x840 is not allowed.

Another thing that you should keep in mind is, that the maximum size for the small image is 630x600. So you don't want to make any features of the map too small, because they need to be legible in the small version too. It helps to look at the map at 75% zoom once in a while, this way you'll see how things would look in the small version.

[Industrial Helix]

They're right about the size... make sure this map is no bigger than 840x800 pixels... Go to Image -> Image size in the very top top menu. This will bring up a window with a whole lotta numbers.

Make sure all your numbers have the chain symbols, which means that your image remains in proportion. The Check box "Constrain Proportions" needs to be checked to get this.

In the "Document Size" area Resolution ought to be 72 pixels/inch. The Width 840 pixels (see the little menu just to the right of the numbers box). The height 800.

If you map doesn't meet these sizes or smaller, use the crop tool. It's the third tool down on the left column of your Left button menu if you can afford to lose the space. OR just change the numbers in the numbers box of the image size menu and let the "constrain proportions do the work.

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Alright,lets talk legends and keys. By the way, we're working with you're A image. Whatever you did to the B image made it save bad and it looks all pixelated. Image A is nice and clear.

You've initially chosen to go with a mini-map in the lower corner, which I think is a real bad idea for what you're trying to accomplish. The map has too many regions for a minimap to work. Plus, you're identifying them by their shields, further confusing the map needlessly. I favor taking a color code style key, of which you can see examples on Pearl Harbor, Third Crusade, Ireland, Africa, ect. This style works best for maps with many different regions.

Minimaps are better for maps with broad regions which can be labeled easily, Such as Greenland, Brazil, Great Lakes, ect. Imagine trying to do Europa, NYC or Chicago with a minimap... I'd be difficult because everything would be crowded. So let's roll with a Color Code style legend.

Right now, let's use the upper left legend. First make a folder over by your layers and Label it "Legend Text." Make sure the folder is highlight and then get the text tool and write out the first region. We'll start with Duchy of Estonia and make our way down. It's nice to have some sort of order int he legend and North to South works great. Make sure the text layer is in the proper folder.

Next we need to figure out how to identify the Duchy of Estonia. This is a Crusades map and you apparently like shields, so lets go with a shield shape. I hope you have the Estonian shield as a separate file, if not get it. Open it up as a new file in cs2 and get your magic wand tool out, 2nd tool down, right column, left side menu. Up top, beneath your file/edit/... menu are a few options: Tolerance helps to determine how picky the wand is going to be in selecting area, the higher the number the less picky it is. I usually keep it around 50. I also like to keep it the "use all layers" check box off. It helps to work with your layers better.

Anyway, select the area around the shield and then go to the Select menu -> Select inverse. You should have the shield selected. Go ahead and hit the delete so you've got the selection in the shape of the shield but not the shield. Go to your main map and click on your color pallet towards the bottom of the left side menu, click the foreground square and it will open the color pallet menu. Move off the menu and you'll get the eye dropper thing, click on the Duchy of Estonia and you'll have the color.

Now go back to your shield and use the paint bucket to make the sheild area the same color as the Duchy of Estonia. Once you've doen that, get your move tool (top right, side menu). and drag the shield from its window to the map window. It's probably too big, so resize it by going to Select -> Transform in the top menu. Make it a little smaller, about the height of you're Duchy of Estonia text in the legend. You can keep proportions by holding down the shift while you resize.

Once its in place, make a folder for it and all other items like it. Label it "Legend shields" and put the shield in the folder. You also should name your layer "Estonian Shield" as well. Now repeat the process for Bishopric of Osel and Wiet, then lithuania, ect.

Once that is done, you should have a nicely organized, clear and concise legend explaining what all the regions are and how much they will be worth (we'll get to that later).

Also, are you using a mac or windows?

[theBastard]

thanks natty for your tips

Make sure all your numbers have the chain symbols, which means that your image remains in proportion. The Check box "Constrain Proportions" needs to be checked to get this.

In the "Document Size" area Resolution ought to be 72 pixels/inch. The Width 840 pixels (see the little menu just to the right of the numbers box). The height 800.

this map is 840 X 800 and I also look how it looks in size 630 x 600. the letters are small I must use bigger.

about proportions, you mean castles, bridges, trees? I think they are good...

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when we do not use small map, the area in the lower corner we can use for legend, too. or?

Next we need to figure out how to identify the Duchy of Estonia. This is a Crusades map and you apparently like shields, so lets go with a shield shape. I hope you have the Estonian shield as a separate file, if not get it. Open it up as a new file in cs2 and get your magic wand tool out, 2nd tool down, right column, left side menu. Up top, beneath your file/edit/... menu are a few options: Tolerance helps to determine how picky the wand is going to be in selecting area, the higher the number the less picky it is. I usually keep it around 50. I also like to keep it the "use all layers" check box off. It helps to work with your layers better.

Anyway, select the area around the shield and then go to the Select menu -> Select inverse. You should have the shield selected. Go ahead and hit the delete so you've got the selection in the shape of the shield but not the shield. Go to your main map and click on your color pallet towards the bottom of the left side menu, click the foreground square and it will open the color pallet menu. Move off the menu and you'll get the eye dropper thing, click on the Duchy of Estonia and you'll have the color.

Now go back to your shield and use the paint bucket to make the sheild area the same color as the Duchy of Estonia. Once you've doen that, get your move tool (top right, side menu). and drag the shield from its window to the map window. It's probably too big, so resize it by going to Select -> Transform in the top menu. Make it a little smaller, about the height of you're Duchy of Estonia text in the legend. You can keep proportions by holding down the shift while you resize.

Once its in place, make a folder for it and all other items like it. Label it "Legend shields" and put the shield in the folder. You also should name your layer "Estonian Shield" as well. Now repeat the process for Bishopric of Osel and Wiet, then lithuania, ect.

but this will made Estonian shield only blue, yes? we could go only with colours or with colours and shiled (which needs much area, I´m afraid), I want show to people something from history of Europe. I will think how to do this...

Once that is done, you should have a nicely organized, clear and concise legend explaining what all the regions are and how much they will be worth (we'll get to that later).

this is sound of future, but I could build game more on auto-deploy (to do castles realy important).
thanks for all your help and advices.

Also, are you using a mac or windows?

I have windows.

[Industrial Helix]

Don't worry about the actual shields and their patterns. I'm brainstorming on how we're going to fit those in there and there are a couple of options. But the important thing is that by having to match the actual shield to the minimap and then to the key is too messy for a CC map. We'll put them in when we tackle some more of the graphics.

Regarding the proportions, I mean size relationships between the small and large maps or regions or what have you, not just the castles and the trees. When something is in proportion it means the smaller or larger version still the same general shape as the previous version... does that make sense? There are tools in cs2 that keep things in proportion when you resize them. This is especially important when you go to make your small map.

So yeah, just get the key up as I said and we'll put the actual shields in later.