Israel

[bigtoughralf]

Türkiye has halted all trade with Israel, in all sectors, in response to Israel's ongoing genocide in Gaza snd its refusal to allow the government of Türkiye to send food, water or medical supplies to Gaza:

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-ea ... 024-05-02/

[bigtoughralf]

The Israeli government has detained and killed a Palestinian doctor, refusing to give any information on how he died. The UN's Special Rapporteur to the situation in Gaza has expressed alarm at the killing and called on national governments to do more to protect Gazans from the Israeli government. With his killing, the total number of medical workers murdered by the Israeli government in Gaza now rises to 500, among the 35,000 civilians killed to date:

A Palestinian doctor has died in an Israeli prison after more than four months in detention, Palestinian prisoner associations have said.

Dr Adnan Al-Bursh, 50, was the head of orthopaedics at al-Shifa Hospital.

Colleagues have paid tribute to the late surgeon, describing him as "compassionate" and "heroic".

Francesca Albanese, the UN Special Rapporteur on the human rights situation in the West Bank and Gaza, said she was "extremely alarmed" by news of Dr Al-Bursh's death and called on the diplomatic community to take concrete measures to protect Palestinians.

Gaza's Hamas-run health ministry said in a statement that Dr Al-Bursh’s death meant that the total number of medical workers who had been killed by Israel since the 7 October attack now stands at 496.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cer3740ddj3o

[Pack Rat]

Release the hostages.

[jusplay4fun]

Release of the Israeli hostages would be a BIG step towards peace in Gaza.

CAIRO (AP) — Israel and Hamas appear to be seriously negotiating an end to the war in Gaza and the return of Israeli hostages. A leaked truce proposal hints at compromises by both sides after months of stalemated talks.

U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken this week praised Israel for offering what he described as significant concessions and saying “ the time is now ” for Hamas to seal the deal. Hamas leaders, meanwhile, say they are reviewing the proposal in a “positive spirit” and sending a team to Egypt in the coming days to continue the talks.

https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-gaza-ceasefire-negotiations-7cec005ccd59dbd817ef9614a8611ca4

[jusplay4fun]

Regarding college student protests in the USA on this topic:

Activist Groups Trained Students for Months Before Campus Protests

The recent wave of pro-Palestinian protests on college campuses came on suddenly and shocked people across the nation. But the political tactics underlying some of the demonstrations were the result of months of training, planning and encouragement by longtime activists and left-wing groups.

At Columbia University, in the weeks and months before police took down encampments at the New York City campus and removed demonstrators occupying an academic building, student organizers began consulting with groups such as the National Students for Justice in Palestine, veterans of campus protests and former Black Panthers.

They researched past protests over Columbia’s expansion into Harlem, went to a community meeting on gentrification and development and studied parallels with the fight over land between Palestinians and Israelis. They attended a “teach-in” put on by several former Black Panthers, who told them about the importance of handling internal disputes within their movement.

“We took notes from our elders, engaged in dialogue with them and analyzed how the university responded to previous protests,” said Sueda Polat, a graduate student and organizer in the pro-Palestinian encampment.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/activist-groups-trained-students-for-months-before-campus-protests/ar-AA1o76g0?ocid=msedgntp&pc=HCTS&cvid=062cf19ce3dc497289dd132cf950c7f8&ei=32

[saxitoxin]

The University of Vermont had disinvited Biden's UN ambassador from delivering its commencement address and ordered her to stay away.

An Instagram post by UVM’s chapter of Students for Justice in Palestine celebrated the cancellation, calling Thomas-Greenfield a “war criminal.”

The Democratic National Committee’s college outreach arm, the College Democrats of America, has also voiced solidarity with the pro-Palestinian protestors and slammed the White House over how it has dealt with the conflict.

https://thehill.com/homenews/education/ ... -protests/

[Pack Rat]

Protester who don't have a clue. Almost half of those arrested were not even students and were agitators. Quite a few of these agitators were known to the police and have been arrested before.

Listening to these privileged kids complain about how unfair life is....well it breaks my fukn heart.

[bigtoughralf]

A similar encampment at Trinity College Dublin has now pushed university leadership to cut financial ties with Israeli organisations involved in the Gaza occupation/West Bank settlements, and to increase support for Palestinian students including scholarships:

https://www.tcd.ie/news_events/articles ... n-trinity/

Trinity College has also taken the opportunity to formally recognise the ICJ's ruling that the Israeli government is engaging in genocide in Gaza.

[Pack Rat]

These student protest were highjacked by anarchists. Support for the Gazan-Palestinians was growing until they started vandalizing and breaking the laws and rules that protected freedom of expression/speech.

You support HAMAS, you are part of the problem.

Release all the hostages would be a good start for negotiations.

[saxitoxin]

offset4gaza.com

[Pack Rat]

Free the remaining hostages...

[jusplay4fun]

Free the remaining hostages...

I agree with Pack Rat on this point.

[bigtoughralf]

The UN General Assembly has voted overwhelmingly to give Palestine full membership of the UN:

http://www.rte.ie/news/world/2024/0510/ ... ddle-east/

While the international community is acknowledging the existence and rights of the Palestinian state, the Israeli government has seized the only open border crossing into Gaza and cut off the aid passing through it:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2024/0510/144834 ... ddle-east/

Seems like asomg as Israel continues to exist, genocide will continue to be on the menu.

[jusplay4fun]

ralph continues his:

1) totally biased support of Hamas,

2) total disregard and/or misunderstanding and/or misuse of the word genocide. (As I recall, Duk clearly showed that ralph does not use the word properly.) Ralph clearly uses that word to try to gain political advantage and not for a realistic evaluation of events.

3) denial or ignoring the facts of the Hamas acts of brutality of Oct. 7;

4) and the fact that Hamas fighters hide among the women and children of Gaza. They hide themselves and their weapons, including rockets aimed for Israel, in and under hospitals, schools, and homes of civilians. Such tactics, in the densely populated urban areas of Gaza, means that in order to kill Hamas fighters (that I will for now avoid calling terrorists) Israelis will kill some civilians.

With these things stated, it is pointless to discuss this matter further with ralph.

It seems to me that:

A) when IDF finishes operation in Rafah that serious negotiations for peace and release of all Israeli hostages must commence, with a long term ceasefire as the main goal.

B) As long as Hamas works for the destruction of the Israeli state, the IDF must be on guard for continued acts of terror by Hamas.

C) from a historical perspective,

i) it seems to me that there were ALWAYS some Jews in the area of Palestine;

ii) some of this partitioned land of Palestine was given to Jews after WWII, and much land was intended for Jewish refugees from Europe, including Sephardic Jews;

iii) the rest and other lands (except for Jerusalem and few other small areas) were given to Arabs and is now controlled by the country of Jordan. Later, displaced Palestinians gained poltical control of the West Bank and of the small Gaza Strip. As far as I can determine, the Palestinian Authority has some political control in the West Bank, and Hamas has political control of Gaza. Like a dictatorship, Hamas has NOT allowed elections in Gaza since taking power in 2006, some 18 years ago.

Early in the second century A.D., the Emperor Hadrian prohibited the Jews from entering Jerusalem. From that period dates the dispersion of Jews throughout the world. Since then, until the establishment of the State of Israel in 1948, no Jewish Government has existed in Palestine. Although some Jews have always lived in Palestine, their numbers have fluctuated depending on the tolerance of the successive rulers.

https://www.un.org/unispal/document/auto-insert-206581/

[bigtoughralf]

3) denial or ignoring the facts of the Hamas acts of brutality of Oct. 7

I've explicitly said that attack was awful at least twice in this thread, including at least once directly to you.

blah blah history shows that..

Not sure what Emperor Hadrian has to do with the IDF stopping food, water and medicine being distributed to the 2 million Gazans living on the brink of famine and with all their hospitals destroyed, but maybe you can help join those dots for us.

[Votanic]

DDS' recent unilateral title change decision on another thread has got me thinking...

@HitRed: Please, change the title of this thread to 'Palrael'. It's only fair.

[HitRed]

DDS' recent unilateral title change decision on another thread has got me thinking...

@HitRed: Please, change the title of this thread to 'Palrael'. It's only fair.

Oct. 7 wasn’t fair.

[Votanic]

DDS' recent unilateral title change decision on another thread has got me thinking...

@HitRed: Please, change the title of this thread to 'Palrael'. It's only fair.

Oct. 7 wasn’t fair.

As opposed to every other day before and after it?

I mean seriously, so some spoiled brats partying at a rave next to a concentration camp got a little kidnappy/rapey/killy blowback ...for once in their entitled lives.

Even le raton-ergout de merde agrees with me, ...well, kinda.

Listening to these privileged kids complain about how unfair life is....well it breaks my fukn heart.

[jusplay4fun]

3) denial or ignoring the facts of the Hamas acts of brutality of Oct. 7

I've explicitly said that attack was awful at least twice in this thread, including at least once directly to you.

blah blah history shows that..

Not sure what Emperor Hadrian has to do with the IDF stopping food, water and medicine being distributed to the 2 million Gazans living on the brink of famine and with all their hospitals destroyed, but maybe you can help join those dots for us.

Excuse me for forgetting that detail. AND THE REST of my points?

It is POINTLESS to discuss Palestine with you, sillyRalph.

[bigtoughralf]

The UN Secretary General has today repeated his stated position that Israel should immediately halt its invasion, as the European Commission President echoed as he called the ongoing ground invasion of Rafah 'unacceptable':

http://www.rte.ie/news/middle-east/2024 ... za-israel/

Rafah is where almost the entire 2 million population of Gaza is currently forced to hide after Israel's invasion drove them out of the rest of the region, and this invasion also closes the only border crossing that was even partly open, thereby sealing off the small amount of aid that was managing to get into Gaza (food for its starving people and medicine in lieu of the hospitals that have been destroyed).

[HitRed]

War was declared in case you missed it.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/20 ... -war-gaza/

[Dukasaur]

The UN Secretary General has today repeated his stated position that Israel should immediately halt its invasion, as the European Commission President echoed as he called the ongoing ground invasion of Rafah 'unacceptable':

http://www.rte.ie/news/middle-east/2024 ... za-israel/

Rafah is where almost the entire 2 million population of Gaza is currently forced to hide after Israel's invasion drove them out of the rest of the region, and this invasion also closes the only border crossing that was even partly open, thereby sealing off the small amount of aid that was managing to get into Gaza (food for its starving people and medicine in lieu of the hospitals that have been destroyed).

Well, isn't it nice for a pampered pussy from a rich family in Lisbon, who has never seen violence first hand, never had to fear for his life, to give lectures on what is acceptable to people who have lived their entire life knowing that the next air-raid siren might bring the Arab missile that blows up their house and kills their entire family.

I wish no harm to Antonio. I'm glad we live in a (mostly) peaceful world where his idyllic existence can continue. But the Jews are fighting for their survival. They're not beating up the people of Gaza for sport or for personal gain, but to root out a murderous gang that will eventually destroy them if they don't destroy it first.

[bigtoughralf]

people who have lived their entire life knowing that the next air-raid siren might bring the Arab missile that blows up their house and kills their entire family.

It's not Arab missiles that have been used to kill 35,000 civilians in their homes over the last 7-8 months. It's Israeli and US missiles.

The US Government has actually just come out and admitted its bombs are being used by the Israeli army to commit war crimes:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-68984999.amp

So, to recap:

• The UN, the ICJ, most world governments including the US and EU, Amnesty International, Red Cross etc: Israel is committing war crimes in Gaza
• The Israeli army, Dukasaur and HitRed: war is war, literally any atrocity whatsoever is justifiable and anyone who says anything different is a snowflake SJW

[Votanic]

people who have lived their entire life knowing that the next air-raid siren might bring the Arab missile that blows up their house and kills their entire family.

It's not Arab missiles that have been used to kill 35,000 civilians in their homes over the last 7-8 months. It's Israeli and US missiles.

The US Government has actually just come out and admitted its bombs are being used by the Israeli army to commit war crimes:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-68984999.amp

So, to recap:

• The UN, the ICJ, most world governments including the US and EU, Amnesty International, Red Cross etc: Israel is committing war crimes in Gaza
• The Israeli army, Dukasaur and HitRed: war is war, literally any atrocity whatsoever is justifiable and anyone who says anything different is a snowflake SJW

The problem here ralf, is you act like such words matter. They don't, even if 'acronyms' say them.
The only reason this 'Palrael' thread exists is because Hamas decide to stop wasting words and finally took some action. ...and OC, the Fascists hated that.
Still... at this point, the only actions big enough to really have lasting import/impact are Thermo-nuclear actions.
Actually, there are other options... I suppose burning off the Ozone Layer just before the next X-Class solar flare might work...
...or does anyone have an asteroid/comet about 10+ miles across that they wouldn't mind wrecking in a demolition derby with planet Earth?

[HitRed]

Worth watching