wow that's unfair!

got tonkaed · Post by **got tonkaed** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 5:54 pm

its in the first post you make on page 8 of the other thread.

Napoleon Ier · Post by **Napoleon Ier** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 5:59 pm

Societal adavancement only a positive externality of capitalism. And I never suggested we impose it.

got tonkaed · Post by **got tonkaed** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:01 pm

Napoleon Ier wrote:Societal adavancement only a positive externality of capitalism. And I never suggested we impose it.

clearly advancement cannot occur unless a majority of people buy into the system as it is, thus in order for progress to occur people cannot be free. Still progress must occur in order to for the system to function, therefore the notion of the freedom of it, must be imposed onto people.

You didnt exactly say it, but the implication is exceedingly clear.

Napoleon Ier · Post by **Napoleon Ier** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:05 pm

got tonkaed wrote:
Napoleon Ier wrote:Societal adavancement only a positive externality of capitalism. And I never suggested we impose it.
clearly advancement cannot occur unless a majority of people buy into the system as it is, thus in order for progress to occur people cannot be free. Still progress must occur in order to for the system to function, therefore the notion of the freedom of it, must be imposed onto people.

You didnt exactly say it, but the implication is exceedingly clear.

No! You miss the point, this time! Capitalism advances society without anyon ebing forced to do anything.

got tonkaed · Post by **got tonkaed** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:07 pm

Napoleon Ier wrote:
got tonkaed wrote:
Napoleon Ier wrote:Societal adavancement only a positive externality of capitalism. And I never suggested we impose it.
clearly advancement cannot occur unless a majority of people buy into the system as it is, thus in order for progress to occur people cannot be free. Still progress must occur in order to for the system to function, therefore the notion of the freedom of it, must be imposed onto people.

You didnt exactly say it, but the implication is exceedingly clear.
No! You miss the point, this time! Capitalism advances society without anyon ebing forced to do anything.

how...how can society advance if no one works for the wages, and if people dont consume the goods.

if you explain taht one too me i will become a believer.

Napoleon Ier · Post by **Napoleon Ier** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:09 pm

It won't. Except people will. Wihtout being forced to, they must for their own interest. But there's no komissar telling them to or making them work in a pecific place.

got tonkaed · Post by **got tonkaed** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:12 pm

Napoleon Ier wrote:It won't. Except people will. Wihtout being forced to, they must for their own interest. But there's no komissar telling them to or making them work in a pecific place.

i think part of the problem we have is you only see one kind of explicit force and you completly miss the otherwise societal pressure which has pretty much the same consequences, simply because you like the premise of the system as a result.

If you really think people are not pressured into certain societal roles, there are quite a wealth of applied psychological and sociological and anthropological, and economical articles you could look at.

Now i wont point you to a specific one, because every single one will show in a variety of capacities these pressures.

Napoleon Ier · Post by **Napoleon Ier** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:22 pm

Yeah...and it's up to individuals whether they want to give in. I'm not forcing them to, and no-one has a right to.

got tonkaed · Post by **got tonkaed** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:28 pm

Napoleon Ier wrote:Yeah...and it's up to individuals whether they want to give in. I'm not forcing them to, and no-one has a right to.

i think youve made my point by and large, its just you dont actually realize it.

mandalorian2298 · Post by **mandalorian2298** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:23 pm

suggs wrote:But the alternative is to say "Shut up, I dont think you're intelligent enough to vote", and NO ONE has the right to say that, as all humans are fallible.
Democracy is the most equitable system yet devised.

Then why do people recieve the right to vote at 18? Surely teenagers and todlers are no more or less fallible then the avarage adult. Isn't it kind of judgmental towards the kids to deny them their voting priviledges on account of their lack of undeveloped inteligence and their ignorance about the relevant political informations, when the adults are allowed to vote despite THEIR lacks in those same areas.

BTW good job with provining my "People are more interested in slogans then in thinking" theory. "Democracy is the most equitable system yet devised." Sure is catchy!

suggs wrote:
bedub1 wrote:Affirmative Action is racism.
You are quite right. But its one of those odd cases where an"ism" actually brings more good than harm, so on utilitarian grounds, it's still cool.

And it's fighting against a much more prevalent and endemic racism, ie white men still rule most of the world. So i think a bit of racism the other way round is probably fair enough for the next hundred years or so.

Racism wouldn't exist were there not some people out there who thought that it's "ok in this case". The cause why the persecution of the jews started was their proficiancy in banking and money lending. Since they have been so succesfull, smart people like you decided that it couldn't hurt to deny them a few civil liberties and maybe beat up on the from time to time for good measure. I guess that the eternal truth still holds: "Mediocrites can't help but to hate the succesfull."

Snorri1234 · Post by **Snorri1234** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:35 pm

mandalorian2298 wrote: Then why do people recieve the right to vote at 18? Surely teenagers and todlers are no more or less fallible then the avarage adult.

....Seriously, you believe that?

Isn't it kind of judgmental towards the kids to deny them their voting priviledges on account of their lack of undeveloped inteligence and their ignorance about the relevant political informations,

What? That's not the reason to deny them their vote, it's just that indeed intelligence and also responsibility factor a great deal in this. We don't let kids vote for the same reason we don't prosecute them as adults and also for the same reason that they receive a number of special treatments. Kids can not be relied on to be responsible in the same way as adults. Sure some are responsible at a young age, but most aren't.

when the adults are allowed to vote despite THEIR lacks in those same areas.

Most adults can be relied on to be decently responsible. It's why they can drive cars and drink booze.

BTW good job with provining my "People are more interested in slogans then in thinking" theory. "Democracy is the most equitable system yet devised." Sure is catchy!

Democracy is the only way it works, period. Unless you come up with a better system, you can't dismiss it.

Racism wouldn't exist were there not some people out there who thought that it's "ok in this case".

Yes it would.

The cause why the persecution of the jews started was their proficiancy in banking and money lending.

A.K.A. jealousy. Tell me what that has to do with AA?

Quinton · Post by **Quinton** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:00 pm

I believe the mandalorin is correct, in regards to his opinions on affirmative action.

suggs · Post by **suggs** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:03 pm

Affirmative action increases overall happiness and stability of a society, so its a good thing.

Quinton · Post by **Quinton** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:05 pm

suggs wrote:Affirmative action increases overall happiness and stability of a society, so its a good thing.

lolololololololololololololololololol

Sorry for that dreadful outburst, my inner n00b needed to release that.

Yeah, it gives me a fuzzy warm feeling inside, like the sight of hopping pink bunny-wabbits on a warm sunny day. I feel so ecstatic, that my heart bleeds with love, pure energy, an offering to my fellow earth-children, on our way to haapyland, on a big yellow boat, made of cheescake.

Guiscard · Post by **Guiscard** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:06 pm

mandalorian2298 wrote:Racism wouldn't exist were there not some people out there who thought that it's "ok in this case". The cause why the persecution of the jews started was their proficiancy in banking and money lending. Since they have been so succesfull, smart people like you decided that it couldn't hurt to deny them a few civil liberties and maybe beat up on the from time to time for good measure. I guess that the eternal truth still holds: "Mediocrites can't help but to hate the succesfull."

Nah. It was religious difference. The banking and moneylending trades were areas they were railroaded into, by and large, because they were forbidden to own land, employ non-jews etc.

suggs · Post by **suggs** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:10 pm

Quinton wrote:
suggs wrote:Affirmative action increases overall happiness and stability of a society, so its a good thing.
lolololololololololololololololololol

Sorry for that dreadful outburst, my inner n00b needed to release that.

Yeah, it gives me a fuzzy warm feeling inside, like the sight of hopping pink bunny-wabbits on a warm sunny day. I feel so ecstatic, that my heart bleeds with love, pure energy, an offering to my fellow earth-children, on our way to haapyland, on a big yellow boat, made of cheescake.

You got a point, or do you wish to continue dribbling?

Snorri1234 · Post by **Snorri1234** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:11 pm

Guiscard wrote:
mandalorian2298 wrote:Racism wouldn't exist were there not some people out there who thought that it's "ok in this case". The cause why the persecution of the jews started was their proficiancy in banking and money lending. Since they have been so succesfull, smart people like you decided that it couldn't hurt to deny them a few civil liberties and maybe beat up on the from time to time for good measure. I guess that the eternal truth still holds: "Mediocrites can't help but to hate the succesfull."
Nah. It was religious difference. The banking and moneylending trades were areas they were railroaded into, by and large, because they were forbidden to own land, employ non-jews etc.

Weren't christians forbidden from lending money to others either, so that the only ones who could become moneylenders were jews?

suggs · Post by **suggs** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:13 pm

You are right, as usual, Snorri.
"usury" was against the law in most of Western Europe until...er...shit, i never finished that Medieval history course...

Quinton · Post by **Quinton** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:15 pm

Ya know suggs, I've got a lot to add.

YOU SMELL.

Ha.

Quinton · Post by **Quinton** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:16 pm

f*ck, it sucks being canadian.

suggs · Post by **suggs** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:26 pm

"Canada-the lynch-pin of the Western world" - W.S. Churchill.

brooksieb · Post by **brooksieb** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:41 pm

due to recent complaints about my speeling im gonna correct the page soon

suggs · Post by **suggs** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:45 pm

Who cares about spelling? As long as people can understand you, it doesn't matter. Communication is all that matters-grammar and spelling are completely arbitrary anyway. Way any.

Quinton · Post by **Quinton** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:47 pm

suggs wrote:Who cares about spelling? As long as people can understand you, it doesn't matter. Communication is all that matters-grammar and spelling are completely arbitrary anyway. Way any.

the fuk whot talk you bout?

suggs · Post by **suggs** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:57 pm

Quinton wrote:
suggs wrote:Who cares about spelling? As long as people can understand you, it doesn't matter. Communication is all that matters-grammar and spelling are completely arbitrary anyway. Way any.
the fuk whot talk you bout?

Better, better...Now try more than one sentence at a time.
Its time to say goodbye to Mr. Stabilizers, Quimton.