Why weight classes are BS in professional fighting

[GabonX]

There is over a hundred pounds difference between these two fighters and the smaller one wins.
First link is the whole fight, second is the knock out punch. Thoughts?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zLkLTn8Onc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZYyyo_1 ... re=related

[muy_thaiguy]

Both are stand up fighters with little ground game. If it HAD gone to the ground and Crop Kop's opponent knew some jiu jitsu or judo, then Cro Kop would have been taken out without to much concern. Not dissing him, just that he is more of a stand up fighter then ground.

[GabonX]

Thats true, Cro Kop isn't the best on the ground. He has very good defense there (watch his fight with Gabriel Gonzaga) but he isn't likely to end the fight unless he's on his feet. Still, I think that this fight shows that people of varying weight can be put against each other to create dynamic fights. Contrary to what people believe, bigger is not always better.

[muy_thaiguy]

Thats true, Cro Kop isn't the best on the ground. He has very good defense there (watch his fight with Gabriel Gonzaga) but he isn't likely to end the fight unless he's on his feet. Still, I think that this fight shows that people of varying weight can be put against each other to create dynamic fights. Contrary to what people believe, bigger is not always better.

I know, but most MMA fighters do have ground game of some sort. Though there are the rare exceptions (like these two) and all it takes is a well placed jab or hook to finish a fight. Though even then, you may just rock them.

[GabonX]

Don't forget about high kicks. This is Cro Kop we're talking about.

[muy_thaiguy]

Don't forget about high kicks. This is Cro Kop we're talking about.

True, but not every fighter has experience in kick boxing, and will instead use body kicks, punches, or take it to the ground. Like Randy Couture.

[GabonX]

Randy Couture. There's another one who just defeated a bigger, maybe stronger opponent in his last fight. And call me crazy but I think Anderson Silva could take quite a few professional fighters who are twice his weight!

[HapSmo19]

Actually, it was the kick to the ribs that took that gorilla down.

[GabonX]

You could be right on that. To me it looked like he got rocked by that punch but Mirko is known to kick hard.

[gdeangel]

First, the big guy went into the corner flat footed, and rather than try to dodge or move in quickly, lumbered in. The kick caused him to open up the head when he blocked, and he got hit square on in the temple. Look closely and you'll see both guys legs are about the same build. That's probably why the big guy went out of his way to block the kick instead of advancing through it... and he was flat footed and, again, tired. Also a few or the earlier punches did land on his face, so he was probably ringing a little already as he went into the corner. The little guy stuck to a plan, dodge, tie up, and focus on the head. The final punch - the little white guy got his power behind a well directed punch, and the big guy was planted. Only one place for him to go - down (or got back to the arm wrestling circuit)!

The big guy had lousy aerobic conditioning and was slow. That's all there is to it.

[HapSmo19]

Look even closer. The kick snuck in under the arm and slapped him in the ribs/liver. Ouch.

Does watching this over and over with a sense of pride(misplaced I know) that the white guy took him down make me a racist?

[GabonX]

About as racist as the title "White Man Can't Jump." Alot of people make comments about how black people are better basket ball players, boxers, fighters etc. than white people. In MMA there are actualy alot of good fighters of varrying races.

Don't be to cocky about Mirko winning this one though. Below is a fight where he loses rather quickly to a much smaller (than Sapp) black opponent.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1zJNZH7 ... re=related

[GabonX]

I found a video that shows the punch from another angle and I would have to say that it was definately the punch, not the kick that finished off Sapp. Fast forward to 4:04
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giJxnhvK2js

[xeno]

Finally! Someone has found a single example of a featherwieght knocking out a heavyweight. Well this proves it! WEIGHT CLASSES ARE BULLSHIT!!

dumass. lets see one of yall take on a 300 pound mindless ape when you're a good 170 fighter.

[HapSmo19]

cro cop is a heavyweight

[Iz Man]

cro cop is a heavyweight

That was going to be my point.
Both of these fighters are heavyweights.
i.e. in the same weight class.

I think it was a good thing the UFC changed to where it is now, although I feel a lot of fights are stopped sooner than they should be.
I also think the "regular" fights should go to 5 rounds, with the belt fights going to 7.

Too many fights are left to the judges.

[muy_thaiguy]

cro cop is a heavyweight

That was going to be my point.
Both of these fighters are heavyweights.
i.e. in the same weight class.

I think it was a good thing the UFC changed to where it is now, although I feel a lot of fights are stopped sooner than they should be.
I also think the "regular" fights should go to 5 rounds, with the belt fights going to 7.

Too many fights are left to the judges.

True that. I would really like to see more knockouts and tap outs.

[Iz Man]

cro cop is a heavyweight

That was going to be my point.
Both of these fighters are heavyweights.
i.e. in the same weight class.

I think it was a good thing the UFC changed to where it is now, although I feel a lot of fights are stopped sooner than they should be.
I also think the "regular" fights should go to 5 rounds, with the belt fights going to 7.

Too many fights are left to the judges.

True that. I would really like to see more knockouts and tap outs.

Absolutely.
I think it would really add to the UFC's domination of professional fighting.
I was always (not so much now) a big boxing fan; but Don King & his ilk killed the sport. The UFC has (since Dana & his buddies took over) really worked at "legitimizing" MMA.
Lets hope Dana White doesn't follow in boxing's footsteps. I don't think he will.

[TheLucas]

I think it would really add to the UFC's domination of professional fighting. I was always (not so much now) a big boxing fan; but Don King & his ilk killed the sport. The UFC has (since Dana & his buddies took over) really worked at "legitimizing" MMA. Lets hope Dana White doesn't follow in boxing's footsteps. I don't think he will.

Amen to that. I saw a debate between Joe Rogan and some boxing analyst and Rogan tore him a new one! MMA style fighting encompasses almost all aspects of fighting while boxing only highlights one. UFC is the wave of the future as long as they don't tinker with the things that are right with it.

[Ritter8point0]

Still, I think that this fight shows that people of varying weight can be put against each other to create dynamic fights. Contrary to what people believe, bigger is not always better.

Maybe this fight is an exeption instead of a rule? I mean, there HAS to be a valid reason for weight classes right? *reads topic subject* Oh. I don't know a whole lot about pro-fighting, but if a "good small guy" fought a "good big guy" would the good big guy win 75% of the time or more.. hmmm.. People do move up weight classes and do well for themselves though. There is that spider silva guy who is moving up a wieght class now right? And I think that the chuck lidell guy has been in a few different weight classes. You might be right.. It just depends on what two fighters are matched up.

[muy_thaiguy]

I think it would really add to the UFC's domination of professional fighting. I was always (not so much now) a big boxing fan; but Don King & his ilk killed the sport. The UFC has (since Dana & his buddies took over) really worked at "legitimizing" MMA. Lets hope Dana White doesn't follow in boxing's footsteps. I don't think he will.

Amen to that. I saw a debate between Joe Rogan and some boxing analyst and Rogan tore him a new one! MMA style fighting encompasses almost all aspects of fighting while boxing only highlights one. UFC is the wave of the future as long as they don't tinker with the things that are right with it.

Sorry, but this has to be said. Rogan is not the "go to" guy for MMA. Trust me on this.

[Juan_Bottom]

Sorry, but this has to be said. Rogan is not the "go to" guy for MMA. Trust me on this.

Ditto. But in his defense, he has been around a while, and he does know what is going on.

True that. I would really like to see more knockouts and tap outs.

Personally, I would rather see fighters enjoy a longer, healthier career; Otherwise, the best fighters will avoid MMA, or always be retired early.

I was always (not so much now) a big boxing fan; but Don King & his ilk killed the sport. The UFC has (since Dana & his buddies took over) really worked at "legitimizing" MMA.

Ditto, Ditto. Anyone else's family keep a set of boxing gloves in the closet for "family disagreements."

Anyone else have a stripclub nearby where they can make $150 a night winning open enrollment MMA style fights?

[GabonX]

To the people who contested my orriginal point that weight classes are BS.

Have you seen the old UFC tournaments. Have you ever heard of Royce Gracie? I didn't think so.

The UFC started out without weight classes and at the time it really was the "Ultimate Fighting Champinship." Somebody earlier mentioned that the Anderson Silva is moving up a weight class. Hopefully this won't detract to much from his speed as this was always one of his strong points. The bigger a fighter gets the slower he is and it should be up to them to find their ideal balance. A champion should defy conventional logic and anyone who knows anything about the history of the sport knows that bigger is not always better.

[GabonX]

Oh and also, Bob Sapp is what you would call a super heavy weight, a whole weight class above Crocop.

[Ritter8point0]

To the people who contested my orriginal point that weight classes are BS.

Have you seen the old UFC tournaments. Have you ever heard of Royce Gracie? I didn't think so.

The UFC started out without weight classes and at the time it really was the "Ultimate Fighting Champinship." Somebody earlier mentioned that the Anderson Silva is moving up a weight class. Hopefully this won't detract to much from his speed as this was always one of his strong points. The bigger a fighter gets the slower he is and it should be up to them to find their ideal balance. A champion should defy conventional logic and anyone who knows anything about the history of the sport knows that bigger is not always better.

Hey, that was me, I mentioned Anderson Silva! Heh heh, and I don't even know that much about MMA, just what I've seen once in a while on Spike! tv and that recent free one with Kimbo Slice or whatever.. I've heard of Royce Gracie.. don't know anything about him.. isn't there like a whole family of Gracies?

Yeah, the OLD ufcs didn't have weight classes.. or rules pretty much.. wern't you just as likly to see two bikers in street clothes having a brawl as you were to see to people schooled in a "fighting style?" I seem to remember seeing some clips on one of the UFC "nothing but KO's" shows where it looked like a bar fight in the ring. lol. And in the OLD OLD ones didn't they have like a single elimination tournament all in one night?

Now a days everyone is in weight classes, there are a ton of "safety rules", and everyone knows like twently different fighting styles. There is too much ground blocking and ground positioning you know? They need to have a few MMA groups that are more stand up and less ground.. like wasn't PRIDE more about fighting stand up? But UFC bought pride right? Sorry I seem to be taking the topic off of weight classes and into a more general relm of discusion..