Treating the Pill as Abortion.

[JACKAZZTJM]

i melt my girls pill over spoon and lighter than inject it into her buttocks with a syringe trust me she aint gettin pregnant i been hittin it rawdogg ever since

[Prestor Jack]

pills > condoms

[jay_a2j]

But then you're saying murder is OK. I always thought that the entire idea of the abortion debate was when life started exactly, as, clearly, taking a human life is by no means allowable.

Abortion has always been about when life starts. The pro-choice can NOT admit it starts at conception or they are condoning murder. You thought Hitler was bad? Welcome to the American Holocaust, 4,000 killed every day due to abortion.

[InkL0sed]

It isn't human until it can suffer, in my book.

[2dimes]

Actually Jay, you're right on the abortion part, it destroys a fertilized egg, the pill destroys an unfertilized one. Granted it would be destroyed in 28 days by the woman's natural cycle, the pill accelerates the process hormonaly.

[Backglass]

Why do liberal americans feel its neccesary to tell people they hate their own country? Its kinda pathetic

Kinda like christians always telling atheists they hate gods?

Actually Jay, you're right on the abortion part, it destroys a fertilized egg, the pill destroys an unfertilized one. Granted it would be destroyed in 28 days by the woman's natural cycle, the pill accelerates the process hormonaly.

Now now...don't confuse him with Science...he doesn't have "faith" in it!

[Jenos Ridan]

Some day, this will escalate the the point where a man can say, "If you don't agree to have unprotected sex with me, you're denying a baby the right to live."

That's an extreme I hope we never get to. I believe life, as a biological thing, begins at conception; strictly speaking, a fertilized human egg is, biologically, a human being. However, I have little problem with people being responcible and taking precautions to prevent unwanted pregancy; if you cannot save it for marrage, then don't be a dumbass. However, I am dead set against abortion 'cept in cases of medical reasons (might injure/kill the mother) and rape/incest.

I know that my views have never been all that popular, so I don't expect a warm welcome.

[MeDeFe]

That's an extreme I hope we never get to. I believe life, as a biological thing, begins at conception; strictly speaking, a fertilized human egg is, biologically, a human being. However, I have little problem with people being responcible and taking precautions to prevent unwanted pregancy; if you cannot save it for marrage, then don't be a dumbass. However, I am dead set against abortion 'cept in cases of medical reasons (might injure/kill the mother) and rape/incest.

I know that my views have never been all that popular, so I don't expect a warm welcome.

I can agree 100% with the bolded part. About 20% with the part before that, I'd change a lot of the terminology ('biologically' to 'genetically' for example). And maybe 70-75% with the last part to include early term abortions, people might get unlucky, a condom might be damaged, and if people are dumbasses and believe urban legends like "you can't get pregnant the first time you have sex" they're probably too dumb to handle a pregnancy as well.

[Snorri1234]

and if people are dumbasses and believe urban legends like "you can't get pregnant the first time you have sex" they're probably too dumb to handle a pregnancy as well.

Word. The people most likely to have an unwanted pregnancy are the ones that really shouldn't have any children.

[PopeBenXVI]

Hey guys, just thought I would chime in on this as you don't have all the facts. The pill has two features.
1. Is to prevent an egg from being released from the overies thus preventing fertilization. This primary method fails often especially on low hormone pills.

2. When The first part fails the second aspect of the pill is hardening the lining of the uterous which prevents the implantation of the FERTILIZED EGG (AKA HUMAN BEING) Women on the pill effectively have abortions every year and don't even know it.

It is estimated (depending on the hormone level of pill she takes) that the first aspect of the pill can fail 10-30% meaning a woman on the pill can have many abortions without even knowing she is pregnant as the Baby is flushed out in her cycle.

%'s of infertility are also increased greatly by being on the pill for even 2-3 years thus causing women to go with invetro. It's sad that so many people don't hear the truth from the media and women are on the pill for years and dropping their chances to have a baby upwards of 40% and they don't even make the connection as to why they are having the trouble


Hope that info was helpful to you

Totus Tuus

[Huckleberryhound]

Sometimes... I really REALLY hate us.

Anyone listening to GCN this morning? They are talking about this, and more stuff. Amazing what is going on in this F-ed up place. Masterbate into a rag, and that's an illegal abortion.

Awww dude, that makes the average teenager worse than Pol Pott

Freaky logic.

[black elk speaks]

Hey guys, just thought I would chime in on this as you don't have all the facts. The pill has two features.
1. Is to prevent an egg from being released from the overies thus preventing fertilization. This primary method fails often especially on low hormone pills.

2. When The first part fails the second aspect of the pill is hardening the lining of the uterous which prevents the implantation of the FERTILIZED EGG (AKA HUMAN BEING) Women on the pill effectively have abortions every year and don't even know it.

It is estimated (depending on the hormone level of pill she takes) that the first aspect of the pill can fail 10-30% meaning a woman on the pill can have many abortions without even knowing she is pregnant as the Baby is flushed out in her cycle.

%'s of infertility are also increased greatly by being on the pill for even 2-3 years thus causing women to go with invetro. It's sad that so many people don't hear the truth from the media and women are on the pill for years and dropping their chances to have a baby upwards of 40% and they don't even make the connection as to why they are having the trouble


Hope that info was helpful to you

Totus Tuus

you are living proof that people commenting here didn't bother to read the article. it basically says almost the same thing...

Many medical groups disagree. They hold that pregnancy isn't established until several days after conception, when the fertilized egg has grown to a cluster of several dozen cells and burrowed into the uterine wall. Anything that disrupts that process, in their view, is contraception.

from this you can infer what you just said. i was so ready to pounce on that, reading ignorant post after ignorant post half cocked with mis-information that i was actually excited about the debate that would ensue. then you happened along and popped my bubble.

don't get me wrong libs. i agree with you on this one. but you all need to educate yourself before forming an opinion and posting to a comment. you could have started by reading and comprehending the article more closely, asking questions and looking stuff up. you will be better for it in the long run

good on you sir.

i will say, though, that if a woman wants to have a tough uterus, then it should be her choice. she should also be made aware of the facts that you state regarding the infertility problems that they could face by taking the pill. most likely the correlation that you describe there have not historically been known to the scientific community. but moving forward, that should be the information that goes out. like all the other mumbo jumbo about how women are "terminating the life of a whole, separate, unique, living human being" with whom they have an "existing relationship."

personally, i like to pull out.

okay, class is dismissed. i expect your rebuttals by morning. but not you juan, you get an F (capitalized and everything) for wasting your time in front of that damn full length mirror

[Nikolai]

This idea IS ludicrous, neither backed by the Bible, nor science.

...

There is absolutely NO basis for this idea in the Bible.

I can't resist.

So... What about Tamar, whose second husband Onan was struck down by God for spilling his seed on the ground?

I'm kidding... classical theological interpretation of this passage holds that it was Onan's selfishness in refusing to produce an heir for his brother that caused God to strike him dead, not his use of coitus interruptus. But you should be careful what you claim.

Oh, and regarding the abortion potential of birth control pills... let me see, where was that post.

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=4581&p=75746#p75746 - about half way through. This is old news, people.

[deliaselene]

I like how guys freely discuss what women can or can not do .... is this the USA bending over backwards to the Christian minority again?

[black elk speaks]

i don't think that people can blame christians for voicing their opinions and acting in a legal fashion to bring about their moral beliefs. its all a part of the balance. i do suppose that most of the posters in this thread are male, i know that i am, but for the most part, i think that the consensus is that these legal propositions should be cast away.

[Frigidus]

I like how guys freely discuss what women can or can not do .... is this the USA bending over backwards to the Christian minority again?

Hahaha...minority? Are you shitting me? They're pervasive. I assume people are Christian.

[gdeangel]

I seem to remember something about the birth control pill mimics the biology of a pregnant woman... such that, you know, when there's one cake baking, a second one doesn't show up and screw them both up.

So I guess that means that having babies in utero will be causing abortion too if there is any coitus going on before the condition becomes discovered by the otherwise happy expectant mother. I'm sure the shame of all those abortions will cause her to kill herself and the unborn murderer of the no. 2 unborn child. But wait...

[jonesthecurl]

I like how guys freely discuss what women can or can not do .... is this the USA bending over backwards to the Christian minority again?

Hahaha...minority? Are you shitting me? They're pervasive. I assume people are Christian.

She is Australian - you are american. The percentage of commited christians in the two societies is v different.

[Neoteny]

I like how guys freely discuss what women can or can not do .... is this the USA bending over backwards to the Christian minority again?

Hahaha...minority? Are you shitting me? They're pervasive. I assume people are Christian.

She is Australian - you are american. The percentage of commited christians in the two societies is v different.

Well, she was referring to America... we're rather notorious for our religiosity.

[deliaselene]

i don't think that people can blame christians for voicing their opinions and acting in a legal fashion to bring about their moral beliefs. its all a part of the balance. i do suppose that most of the posters in this thread are male, i know that i am, but for the most part, i think that the consensus is that these legal propositions should be cast away.

true elk but from the Australian viewpoint the US governments bends over for the minority fanatic Christian groups ... and thank goodness enough has happened over the years to eliminate the need for knitting needles as a birth control method

[Frigidus]

I like how guys freely discuss what women can or can not do .... is this the USA bending over backwards to the Christian minority again?

Hahaha...minority? Are you shitting me? They're pervasive. I assume people are Christian.

She is Australian - you are american. The percentage of commited christians in the two societies is v different.

Yah, I figured she was from somewhere else. I wish I lived somewhere with a Christian minority.

[deliaselene]

I like how guys freely discuss what women can or can not do .... is this the USA bending over backwards to the Christian minority again?

Hahaha...minority? Are you shitting me? They're pervasive. I assume people are Christian.

She is Australian - you are american. The percentage of commited christians in the two societies is v different.

Yah, I figured she was from somewhere else. I wish I lived somewhere with a Christian minority.

a most emotive topic.. there are several "pills" available that prevent conception which if made more readily available will eliminate the need for such discussion and as I stated eliminates the need for knitting needles...

Australia is still a Christian majority it just that America has a more radical lunatic minority...

[MeDeFe]

But knitting needles are fun, and can be used as chopsticks. Yeah, bring on the dead baby jokes.

[deliaselene]

you miss the point... the life of the woman is important too - at least we moved away from the old ways but not attitudes ... prevention way better than the cure

[PopeBenXVI]

Lots of views here but truth is not based on a majority opinion. The fact is that a fertilized egg (no matter what state in it's development) is in fact a human being. It can not be anything else. When allowed to grow it will always grow into a human baby and not anything else. Being allowed to attach to the uterin wall is merly how it gets its nutrients to grow larger. The fact that the pill hardens the walls to prevent this does not de-legitimize it being a human. The argumant of "when is it a human" has no basis. some pro abortion advocates say it's not a baby until it breaths.......What? Then what the hell is it? "A "Glob of tissue" that even when born many months premature and lives is still guess what.....A Human! Whether 9 months or 9 seconds the only difference is the size and if it is yet self sustaining. It needing the mother to grow is like you needing life support until you heal from a major injury but it does not mean you are not a human.

If murder is wrong...it is always wrong. The Pill kills fertilized eggs...AKA Human Babies. Choose to believe it or not but it is the truth.

Oh, and Onan was struck down for spilling his seed not for not giving his brother an heir. The punishment for not fufilling that duty was not death but a kind of shunning and public embarisment according to Deuteronomy 25. So he was killed for (as Genisis says) "what he did" AKA spilling his sead.......not "what he did not do" AKA supply an Heir.

Hope that all made sence.