Validity of the Bible

s.xkitten · Post by **s.xkitten** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 8:00 pm

are we ever going to just get over this?

mightyal · Post by **mightyal** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 8:09 pm

There were numerous terrorist acts by Zionist groups against British forces in the Palestine in the 1930's (possibly earlier, I'm not an historian) aimed at etablishing the state of Israel.

Caleb the Cruel · Post by **Caleb the Cruel** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 8:09 pm

s.xkitten wrote:are we ever going to just get over this?

Probably not for another couple months I bet.
This is becoming another "Logic Dictates That There Is A God" thread, which I didn't enjoy very much.

s.xkitten · Post by **s.xkitten** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 8:10 pm

me either, thats why i was asking

Backglass · Post by **Backglass** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 9:05 pm

jay_a2j wrote:I don't know what you're smoking but its not tobacco.

jay_a2j wrote:23 years later I'm still smoking.

Hey now...you are the drug smoker, not me. A documented fact!

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:55 pm

Caleb the Cruel wrote:
s.xkitten wrote:are we ever going to just get over this?
Probably not for another couple months I bet.
This is becoming another "Logic Dictates That There Is A God" thread, which I didn't enjoy very much.

I love and enjoy all the similar threads, wonderful time fillers. More fun to be a spectator, like at a Gladiatorial Arena

--Andy

stinkycheese · Post by **stinkycheese** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 11:02 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:
Caleb the Cruel wrote:
s.xkitten wrote:are we ever going to just get over this?
Probably not for another couple months I bet.
This is becoming another "Logic Dictates That There Is A God" thread, which I didn't enjoy very much.
I love and enjoy all the similar threads, wonderful time fillers. More fun to be a spectator, like at a Gladiatorial Arena

--Andy

What are your views on this issue?!?! TELL US!

vtmarik · Post by **vtmarik** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 11:04 pm

stinkycheese wrote:What are your views on this issue?!?! TELL US!

Andy doesn't get involved, he sits in the Mod Box and watches us thralls duke it out.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 11:15 pm

VT's right on the nosey. I try to keep real life out of CC, and I don't want to get spam e-mails from one side or the other stating that I should support their cause and ban all the opposers.

It is amusing to see the debates that go on...in the suggestions area they are talking about year awards...I immediately thought of these threads when I suggested 'best feud'.

Anyways, I'll leave you with a tid bit. If I was precariously perched on a tight rope, and about to fall...9 times out 10 I'd fall left I think.

Keep up the posts! They are something I still enjoy in the Off Topics area.

--Andy

stinkycheese · Post by **stinkycheese** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 11:41 pm

AndyDufresne wrote:VT's right on the nosey. I try to keep real life out of CC, and I don't want to get spam e-mails from one side or the other stating that I should support their cause and ban all the opposers.

It is amusing to see the debates that go on...in the suggestions area they are talking about year awards...I immediately thought of these threads when I suggested 'best feud'.

Anyways, I'll leave you with a tid bit. If I was precariously perched on a tight rope, and about to fall...9 times out 10 I'd fall left I think.

Keep up the posts! They are something I still enjoy in the Off Topics area.

--Andy

So what you're saying is that you're a pretty shitty tight rope walker?

morph · Post by **morph** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 12:34 am

AndyDufresne wrote:VT's right on the nosey. I try to keep real life out of CC, and I don't want to get spam e-mails from one side or the other stating that I should support their cause and ban all the opposers.

It is amusing to see the debates that go on...in the suggestions area they are talking about year awards...I immediately thought of these threads when I suggested 'best feud'.

Anyways, I'll leave you with a tid bit. If I was precariously perched on a tight rope, and about to fall...9 times out 10 I'd fall left I think.

Keep up the posts! They are something I still enjoy in the Off Topics area.

--Andy

lol with all these god threads showing up and the debates that are always going on, might as well rename this area to "Debates and junk" lol hmmm

HEY JAY WHY CANT I BE DEAD TO YOU AS WELL!!! WHY ONLY BACKGLASS... I SEE HOW IT IS YOUR DISCRIMINATING TOWARDS ME!!

and is it just me or is it only Jay that is really argueing anymore... i mean besides caleb... i think everyone, even the creationist people have turned on Jay for the fact that he only picks and chooses what he answers

and someone asked who said the titanium was in the ark... Jay posted a link about the ark after i asked proof of it actually being around.. and in the artical it said that they found titanium that was used to help build the ship soo ya...

Backglass · Post by **Backglass** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 12:46 am

morph wrote:HEY JAY WHY CANT I BE DEAD TO YOU AS WELL!!! WHY ONLY BACKGLASS... I SEE HOW IT IS YOUR DISCRIMINATING TOWARDS ME!!

Sorry...not everyone can be:

Skittlesandmnms · Post by **Skittlesandmnms** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:03 am

morph wrote:HEY JAY WHY CANT I BE DEAD TO YOU AS WELL!!! WHY ONLY BACKGLASS... I SEE HOW IT IS YOUR DISCRIMINATING TOWARDS ME!!

uh...

i'm a jew. i think this means... jay wants me to die, or just wants me to burn in hell?

by the way.

He's YOUR god.

They are YOUR rules.

YOU burn in hell.

jay_a2j · Post by **jay_a2j** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:20 am

morph wrote:
HEY JAY WHY CANT I BE DEAD TO YOU AS WELL!!! WHY ONLY BACKGLASS... I SEE HOW IT IS YOUR DISCRIMINATING TOWARDS ME!!

ROFL! Because I have no problem with you morph. Although you take opposite sides of me.... you don't come off as closeminded as backglass. Where backglass takes every opertunity to thumb his nose at God, you seem more level-headed.

Oh, and if it seems like I "pick and choose" what to respond to its because

1. there are a ton of questions and such being made at once.

2. I don't have all the answers (Like I have no knowledge of titanium)

Skittlesandmnms · Post by **Skittlesandmnms** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:22 am

jay_a2j wrote:
morph wrote:
HEY JAY WHY CANT I BE DEAD TO YOU AS WELL!!! WHY ONLY BACKGLASS... I SEE HOW IT IS YOUR DISCRIMINATING TOWARDS ME!!

ROFL! Because I have no problem with you morph. Although you take opposite sides of me.... you don't come off as closeminded as backglass. Where backglass takes every opertunity to thumb his nose at God, you seem more level-headed.

and he ignores me...

i'm ignored... but not dead to him...

stupid fucking limbo...

vtmarik · Post by **vtmarik** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:26 am

Let's get back on topic here.

Your statements:

jay_a2j wrote:If a man writes down "the Jews will be scattered" and "the Jews will return to their land" and it happens in real time not just written in the Bible. It is NOT the Bible fulfilling its own prophecies! IT IS HISTORY! Look up the facts. The Jews were scattered (as predicted in scripture). And in 1948 The Jews returned to thier homeland Isreal. (also predicted in scripture) My dog understands this, why are you having such a hard time with it?

They "strived for it"???? Um no. It was a result of WWII and the UN establishing the state of Israel in 1948. Millions of Jews dieing must have been part of their plan to "strive" for a return to their land! I don't know what you're smoking but its not tobacco. It is not self-fulfilling as the Jews had nothing to do with re-gaining their land.

The various responses:

areon wrote:You're wrong, David Ben-Gurion and others spent decades petitioning the British to make Israel a Jewish state. They even gave a nice declaration after WWI but didn't carry through with their promise until after WWII. Try not to distort history 101.

mightyal wrote:There were numerous terrorist acts by Zionist groups against British forces in the Palestine in the 1930's (possibly earlier, I'm not an historian) aimed at etablishing the state of Israel.

vtmarik wrote:The prophecy says that the Jews will return to Zion in one generation, free of their oppressors.

I don't know what news channels you're watching, but Israel is surrounded by their oppressors.

Skittlesandmnms · Post by **Skittlesandmnms** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:27 am

yeah the jews kinda got screwed on that one

Backglass · Post by **Backglass** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:35 am

jay_a2j wrote:you don't come off as closeminded as backglass.

Thus speaketh the Pot.

I am open to all possibilities jay. You are closed to one...you have said as much.

jay_a2j wrote: Where backglass takes every opertunity to thumb his nose at God, you seem more level-headed.

Ya can't thumb your nose at imaginary things jay! I THUMB MY NOSE AT YOU ZEUS! Sounds silly doesnt it. Much like your endless stream of quotes from an ancient story book.

jay_a2j wrote:Oh, and if it seems like I "pick and choose"

No. You DO pick & choose. You also avoid the hard questions and attempt to back up stories from scripture with quotes from same.

jay_a2j wrote:I don't have all the answers

I would agree, as you have yet to give us one.

You keep on living your life in fear of gods, demons and the boogey man. I'll open my eyes and live life unafraid.

vtmarik · Post by **vtmarik** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:40 am

Backglass wrote:You keep on living you life in fear of gods, demons and the boogey man. I'll open my eyes and live life unafraid.

That's the one thing about Christianity that no one seems to grasp.

How can we love God, but fear God at the same time?

Can you love heights and fear heights?
Can you love spiders and be afraid of them simultaneously?

If your answer is longer than 2-6 words, you're either not grasping the simplicity of the question or you are probably attempting to rationalize/deflect this dichotomy for some reason.

Backglass · Post by **Backglass** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:47 am

vtmarik wrote:How can we love God, but fear God at the same time?

Because (borrowing from jay's playbook):

GE 4:15, DT 32:19-27, IS 34:8 God is a vengeful god.
EX 15:3, IS 42:13, HE 12:29 God is a warrior. God is a consuming fire.
EX 20:5, 34:14, DT 4:24, 5:9, 6:15, 29:20, 32:21 God is a jealous god.
NU 25:3-4, DT 6:15, 9:7-8, 29:20, 32:21, PS 7:11, 78:49, JE 4:8, 17:4, 32:30-31, ZP 2:2 God is angry. His anger is sometimes fierce.
2SA 22:7-8 (KJV) "I called to the Lord; ... he heard my voice; ... The earth trembled and quaked, ... because he was angry. Smoke came from his nostrils. Consuming fire came from his mouth, burning coals blazed out of it."
EZ 6:12, NA 1:2, 6 God is jealous and furious. He reserves wrath for, and takes revenge on, his enemies. "... who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? His fury is poured out like fire, and rocks are thrown down by him."

BUT

2CO 13:11, 14, 1JN 4:8, 16 God is love.
GA 5:22-23 The fruit of the Spirit of God is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.

Makes it all clear...doesnt it.

There should another one. "God is a dysfunctional god"

vtmarik · Post by **vtmarik** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:50 am

Backglass wrote:
vtmarik wrote:How can we love God, but fear God at the same time?
Because:

GE 4:15, DT 32:19-27, IS 34:8 God is a vengeful god.
EX 15:3, IS 42:13, HE 12:29 God is a warrior. God is a consuming fire.
EX 20:5, 34:14, DT 4:24, 5:9, 6:15, 29:20, 32:21 God is a jealous god.
NU 25:3-4, DT 6:15, 9:7-8, 29:20, 32:21, PS 7:11, 78:49, JE 4:8, 17:4, 32:30-31, ZP 2:2 God is angry. His anger is sometimes fierce.
2SA 22:7-8 (KJV) "I called to the Lord; ... he heard my voice; ... The earth trembled and quaked, ... because he was angry. Smoke came from his nostrils. Consuming fire came from his mouth, burning coals blazed out of it."
EZ 6:12, NA 1:2, 6 God is jealous and furious. He reserves wrath for, and takes revenge on, his enemies. "... who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? His fury is poured out like fire, and rocks are thrown down by him."

BUT

2CO 13:11, 14, 1JN 4:8, 16 God is love.

Makes it all clear...doesnt it.

There should another one. "God is a dysfunctional god"

This facsimile of "God" strikes me as a little bipolar, but as humans transition from mania to depression in as little as an hour, God seems to shift from wrath to happy almost instantaneously.

One moment he's all 10-plagues-wrath-of-god-destroy-it-all and then POOF, he's Mr. Rogers.
When in reality he's totally cool with everything and everyone because he's omnipotent and has the same likes as we do. Some days he wants to watch drama, some days he wants to watch comedy. There is no hell, there is no Satan, and God doesn't give a crap what you believe in as long as you are believing in something positive for you. All mankind, Christian and Non-Christian alike are destined for Heaven, so just let go of this dumb book already. It's all wrong.

Backglass · Post by **Backglass** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:18 am

vtmarik wrote:One moment he's all 10-plagues-wrath-of-god-destroy-it-all and then POOF, he's Mr. Rogers.

Exactly...and why is that? Why does an omniscient being get angry at all? Why all the cloak and dagger? Why the drama? YOUR A GOD. Just do what you want, and be done with it!

It's this whole cosmic ant-farm / rat maze mentality that gets me. He's got the whole world in his hands...BUT he's still going to torture and test you like a twisted kid with a magnifying glass and a few bugs. Better not step out of line, or you'll burn forever!

Why? I have come to the conclusion it is because it's all BS. This concept was created by man to enslave and keep the people in line.

Since time immemorial, the powerful have used religion to distract the oppressed, to encourage them to focus on the next world so that they will acquiesce to the injustices of this world.

If you would have your slaves remain docile, teach them hymns.

morph · Post by **morph** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:21 am

jay_a2j wrote:
morph wrote:
HEY JAY WHY CANT I BE DEAD TO YOU AS WELL!!! WHY ONLY BACKGLASS... I SEE HOW IT IS YOUR DISCRIMINATING TOWARDS ME!!

ROFL! Because I have no problem with you morph. Although you take opposite sides of me.... you don't come off as closeminded as backglass. Where backglass takes every opertunity to thumb his nose at God, you seem more level-headed.

Oh, and if it seems like I "pick and choose" what to respond to its because

1. there are a ton of questions and such being made at once.

2. I don't have all the answers (Like I have no knowledge of titanium)

well... i am level headed i suppose... and ya i realize that is likely why you seem to pick and choose... but i figure for the masses i should go with it... you know this thread is just one big popularity contest ^.^

lesnud · Post by **lesnud** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:30 am

vtmarik wrote:
This facsimile of "God" strikes me as a little bipolar, but as humans transition from mania to depression in as little as an hour, God seems to shift from wrath to happy almost instantaneously.

One moment he's all 10-plagues-wrath-of-god-destroy-it-all and then POOF, he's Mr. Rogers.
When in reality he's totally cool with everything and everyone because he's omnipotent and has the same likes as we do. Some days he wants to watch drama, some days he wants to watch comedy. There is no hell, there is no Satan, and God doesn't give a crap what you believe in as long as you are believing in something positive for you. All mankind, Christian and Non-Christian alike are destined for Heaven, so just let go of this dumb book already. It's all wrong.

All mankind huh? All the rapists, murderers, child molesters, liers, and such should all come to a paradise? I don't think we are talking about the same heaven then, my friend. I'm pretty sure the heaven I heard about isn't a place they want to go. unfortunately, there aren't a lot of options. You're in heaven, or you aren't. And if you aren't, there is only one place you end up going. Of course, I don't know if it's true, because I have never been killed before, so I don't know what it after. If you guys are right, then we all go to nothing afterwards, no loss for anyone. hooray. Life is a joke. If I'm right, then a few of us go to heaven, live for an eternity with an amazing being, while the rest go down to a place of eternal torture. mmm. Isn't that appealing?

And, yes, God has more than one emotion. Don't you think the God who MADE emotions might just have some? He is a loving God, but also a just God. Being just doesn't mean 'oh, you walked all over me, but that's okay.' So, God has vengence, and it will one day be released (yes, I'm trying to scare all of you who don't care into thinking God is going to come and smite you. I'll get that out there before you say that is what I'm saying.). He is just, so he can judge. We aren't, so we can't, but we try anyway. Apparently, those who judge will be judged as they judged others. No room for hipocrisy in heaven.

But, God isn't followed out of fear. Out of awe, yes. The old testament required a law. People needed to stick to this law. People feared God back then because he didn't let priests do whatever they wanted. They had to serve him. Otherwise...he fired them. But God sent his son, his only son, to die for us on the cross. This ties into how God is just. The law required that an unblemished lamb be sacrificed to cleanse the people of their sins. That's why sometimes Jesus is sometimes called the lamb who was slain. He came and lived in a human body, for about thirty three years. Then he died a murderers death, for committing no murder. He died for sins he never committed. Those were ours. Those were mine.

The law had now been fulfilled, and that's why animals are not scarificed for our sins anymore.

This Thread was originally intended to be about the validity of the Bible. This is it. If Jesus never was, then the Bible is nothing more than a book of fairytales. That is the point of the book. That is the intended story. Of how God sent his son to die for us so we can live with him. That is also what Christianity is supposed to be centered on. It might be off at times, but things are easier to change from the inside out.

Enjoy the rant.

morph · Post by **morph** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:35 am

vtmarik wrote:
Backglass wrote:You keep on living you life in fear of gods, demons and the boogey man. I'll open my eyes and live life unafraid.
Can you love spiders and be afraid of them simultaneously?

actually i love spiders, love to watch them and everything else, yet they scare the living shit out of me.. >.>

also you guys should know, your comparing Jay's god to a drunk... lol mr. rogers was always drunk on set lol so your saying god is a drunk lmfao...