[Rescued] Harder Better Faster Stronger

[BaldAdonis]

<NS EDIT>
New tournament thread: http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 91&t=94425
</NS EDIT>

Original Post
http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... ?p=1838579

Rules

The tournament will have 64 players minimum, split into 8 groups of 8 each.
Each group will play 4 rounds - Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger - and each round will have 3 games, so everyone gets 12 games.
Players get points in each round, and those points are tallied up in a standard scoreboard.
The top 4 from each group will go to the next stage, making it 32 players.
We repeat this procedure again to get it down to 16, and once more to get it down to 8 - the final round.
The top 4 of the final round get premium prizes - 1st 12 months, 2nd 6 months, 3rd and 4th 3 months

Ties on the scoreboard are decided by a 5-game series of 1v1s - 2 maps chosen by each player (non-Freestyle), 1 map chosen by yours truly - Waterloo, Sequential, No Cards, Chained, Foggy.

Games

Round 1 - Harder
Played on some of the hardest maps on CC, a round where strategists can shine!

• Maps - Waterloo, Rail Europe, Pearl Harbour
  Standard, Sequential, Escalating, Foggy, Chained

Scoring:
The good ole 'who got knocked out when' method. Knocked out first means you finish 8th, win the game you finish 1st.


Round 2 - Better
Normal maps, normal rules, abnormal scoring. Win, or suffer at the hands of the winner!

• Maps - Europa, Soviet Union, Charleston
  Standard, Sequential, Flat Rate, Sunny, Chained

Scoring:
Winner automatically comes first, and decides who comes second. Second place then decides who comes third, and so on all the way down to 6th place who decides the wooden spooners (they both get 1pt). That's right folks - favouritism can play a part in this round.


Round 3 - Faster
Do damage as quickly as you can, winning doesn't matter.

• Maps - Iceland, Malta, North America
  Terminator, Sequential, Flat Rate, Sunny, Chained

Scoring:
First player to eliminate someone else comes first, and the eliminated player comes 8th. Next eliminated player comes 7th. As for the player making the elimination, if they are not yet placed (ie - not 1st), they come 2nd. If they are already placed, 2nd is still up for grabs. Wash rinse repeat.


Round 4 - Stronger
If you don't win, you'd better hope you have lots of armies left!

• Maps - Conquerman, Poker Club, King of the Mountains
  Assassin, Sequential, Escalating, Sunny, Unlimited

Scoring:
Winner comes first. The 2nd through 8th place is worked out by totalling the number of armies each player has left at the end of the game. Loser with the highest amount of armies comes 2nd, next highest 3rd, and so on. The eliminated player obviously comes last with 1pt. (See below for ties)

Scoring

SCORING
Each game has a clear structure of who came 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc with the exception of Round 4 games. If players are tied on armies at the end of those games, they both place the same, and the next player places one lower. eg - 2 players finish on 12 armies at 3rd place, the next highest player has 11 armies and finishes in 5th (as there are 2 on 3rd).
Points are distributed using Fibonacci numbers, that is, next number is both the previous added together. So 1st place gets the same amount of points as 2nd and 3rd added together. 5th place gets the same amount of points as 6th and 7th added together. You get the picture
1st - 21pts
2nd - 13pts
3rd - 8pts
4th - 5pts
5th - 3pts
6th - 2pts
7th - 1pt
8th - 1pt
Scoring range for a single player over the four rounds (ie 12 games) is 12 points minimum, 252 points maximum. An average score is about 81 points.

Etc.

PRIZES, ENTRY, AND PLACEMENT
(Final group of 8 only!) Overall winner gets 12 months premium, second place gets 6 months, third and fourth place both get 3 months.
Freemiums welcome to join, but if you can't join a game within a 3 day window, you automatically come last in that game, and a 7 player game is made instead. Miss 2 games in a row, or 3 games all up, you get replaced. So try to keep 1 slot open at all times for the tournament.
All three games for a round will be mailed out at once, but if a freemie is low on slots, they need only join one game. The other games will be waiting there, but must be joined as soon as the first game is finished, in order to expediate the tournament.
If entries come flooding in (which they might being open to all and having premium prize) I will up the maximum entrants to 64 from 32, and have a 4 stage tournament. If they really come flooding in, I will increase to 128, and have a three stage tournament, with only the top two going through from each group each round.
Players will be assigned randomly into the groups. Yes folks, the same type of random that applies to the dice, so complain if you must, but I will have none of it
Foe lists of course must be switched off.
Shennanigans (excessive swearing, secret diplomacy, multis in the tournament or outside of it) will see you get the bottom end of my boot to your behind. The farmers that I loathe so dearly are indeed welcome to join, but I'm not going to rest until all of you are busted, and if you're busted while my tournament is ongoing, you're out


CAVEAT
Rules subject to change before tournament begins. Basically, if there is a problem / exploit with the scoring system (aside from the favouritism of Round 2) then I may have to fix it up. If a problem is discovered during play... well... too bad. Hell of a thing to say, but that's the way it's gonna roll folks, I can't change the rules halfway through, that wouldn't be fair.[/quote]

Changes

Players will not be eliminated each round. Everyone will continue through until the end. This is to prevent players from being eliminated based on their play in one game (for example, many players would have been eliminated after two games in the first stage, and would have no reason to try to win the Pearl Harbor game).

Players

Player List
1. e_i_pi
2. gameplayer
3. GrimReaper.
4. Gilligan
5. Inkl0sed
6. CunningImp*
7. InsomniaRed
8. lanyards
9. dittoeevee8888
10. Moneymatt
11. Stephen Wayne
12. Evil Semp
13. DimnjacarStef
14. poptartpsycho18
15. Keellan*
16. Lucky6
17. killmanic
18. FireStar
19. DBandit70
20. Chariot of Fire
21. Artimis
22. pvanhuffel
23. Blitzaholic
24. ga7
25. Hopscotcher*
26. Godd
27. zissou2
28. Gypsys Kiss
29. acores2005
30. Aradhus
31. John Price
32. ledaddycool
33. GlobeSmack
34. alamo1234321*
35. harvmax
36. MrMoody
37. negoeien
38. mrbang
39. bigreuben*
40. HighlanderAttack
41. Downey
42. lhcguy*
43. Shatners Bassoon
44. pimphawks70
45. AndrewB
46. ralphcptc
47. coded
48. Bolo XXXV
49. Barry Zuckerkorn
50. icedagger*
51. Don 1
52. FroZzenSlayer
53. Mr_Adams*
54. blakebowling
55. ubersky
56. Bigragooch
57. R0k0v
58. seamusvibe
59. Jalapeno*
60. lehmanjk
61. FloresDelMal
62. vykingsfan64
63. shadowllama
64. BaldAdonis
-----
Reserves
A. Witt13
B. Annexator
C. mkcummins
D. olkok
E. skillfusniper33
F. PL
-----
* Denotes freemium player

Previous Games and Results

Stage 1 Group A

Jalapeno
Hopscotcher
seamusvibe
Don 1
killmanic
coded
Artimis
Blitzaholic

Stage 1 Group B

alamo1234321
R0k0v
DimnjacarStef
DBandit70
John Price
pimphawks70
InsomniaRed
blakebowling

Stage 1 Group C

Mr_Adams
acores2005
Gypsys Kiss
poptartpsycho18
negoeien
pvanhuffel
zissou2
ledaddycool

Stage 1 Group D

Keellan
FireStar
Stephen Wayne
shadowllama
ga7
Lucky6
Evil Semp
Bigragooch

Stage 1 Group E

CunningImp
gameplayer
Shatners Bassoon
lehmanjk
Inkl0sed
AndrewB
Chariot of Fire
BaldAdonis

Stage 1 Group F

lhcguy
FloresDelMal
Godd
Downey
e_i_pi
HighlanderAttack
Gilligan
Moneymatt

Stage 1 Group G

bigreuben
Bolo XXXV
harvmax
Aradhus
FroZzenSlayer
dittoeevee8888
mrbang
MrMoody

Stage 1 Group H

icedagger
GlobeSmack
ralphcptc
Barry Zuckerkorn
vykingsfan64
lanyards
ubersky
GrimReaper.

Round 1

- Waterloo, Sequential, Chained, Escalating, Foggy
Group A - Game 3955950
Group B - Game 3955951
Group C - Game 3955952
Group D - Game 3955954
Group E - Game 3955956
Group F - Game 3955958
Group G - Game 3955960
Group H - Game 3955961

Round 2

Rail Europe, Sequential, Chained, Escalating, Foggy
Group A - Game 3988347
Group B - Game 3988369
Group C - Game 3988372
Group D - Game 3988373
Group E - Game 3988376
Group F - Game 3988380
Group G - Game 3988382
Group H - Game 3988384

Round 3

Pearl Harbor, Sequential, Chained, Escalating, Foggy
Group A - Game 4244100
Group B - Game 4244101
Group C - Game 4244102
Group D - Game 4244103
Group E - Game 4244104
Group F - Game 4244106
Group G - Game 4244107
Group H - Game 4244108

Scores

[Blitzaholic]

thx bald for taking it over


any updates who is left?

[Hopscotcher]

Ditto to Blitz. Thanks for resuming the tournament even though I'll likely tank

[BaldAdonis]

any updates who is left?

Everyone plays all the way through to the final round, so everyone is still in. The first two maps of round 1 are completed, so I'll get that Pearl Harbor game out to you as soon as I get privileges to run this. I just need the players list from e_i_pi and I can make some updates.

[e_i_pi]

any updates who is left?

Everyone plays all the way through to the final round, so everyone is still in. The first two maps of round 1 are completed, so I'll get that Pearl Harbor game out to you as soon as I get privileges to run this. I just need the players list from e_i_pi and I can make some updates.

Sent

[Blitzaholic]

Ditto to Blitz. Thanks for resuming the tournament even though I'll likely tank

BaldAdonis deserves the credit, not me, he took it over.

[Hopscotcher]

I meant ditto as in... repeat of what you said lol

[FroZzenSlayer]

can you also update the standings since the 2 games have been played?

[BaldAdonis]

can you also update the standings since the 2 games have been played?

Should be up soon. I'm just messing with the formatting to make it look good.

[bigreuben]

Don't get me wrong but I think the scoring should be separated by groups and not all together:
I think it should look more like this:

Spoiler

Group A:
1. coded: ___________29 pts
2. killmanic: ________22 pts
3. Blitzaholic: _______16 pts
3. Artimis: _________16 pts
5. Jalapeno: _________9 pts
6. Hopscotcher: ______7 pts
7. Don 1: ____________6 pts
8. seamusvibe:_______ 3 pts

Group B:
1. John Price: ________29 pts
2. DBandit70: ________22 pts
3. R0k0v: ___________16 pts
4. InsomniaRed: _____14 pts
5. blakebowling: _____10 pts
6. alamo1234321: _____9 pts
7. DimnjacarStef:_____ 4 pts
7. pimphawks70: ______4 pts

and so on for the rest of the groups...

[lhcguy]

Bigreuben is right.. (also, i wrote my own little c++ tool, to show me the stats of my own group, including the chance of getting to the next level, when the rest of the games are completly random)...

[BaldAdonis]

Don't get me wrong but I think the scoring should be separated by groups and not all together.

Ah, but if everyone plays 12 games, then the groups won't be static. Once you finish a stage, you'll be shuffled. If I eliminated players at each stage, then keeping groups (and group scores) together would be vital. So unless you want to play 12 8-player games with the same group, I'll need to put everyone's scores together.

[bigreuben]

Don't get me wrong but I think the scoring should be separated by groups and not all together.

Ah, but if everyone plays 12 games, then the groups won't be static. Once you finish a stage, you'll be shuffled. If I eliminated players at each stage, then keeping groups (and group scores) together would be vital. So unless you want to play 12 8-player games with the same group, I'll need to put everyone's scores together.

O.K I see our problem... We think that all of us understood the settings for this tourney while actually it's much less then that...
I'll go through the original post and will try to give the explanation to what I understood from it, I think it would be great if anyof the participants that understood something differently will write it so we all can be on the same page.

The tournament will have 64 players minimum, split into 8 groups of 8 each.
Each group will play 4 rounds - Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger - and each round will have 3 games, so everyone gets 12 games.

What I understand from this is that each player will play 3 Harder games, 3 Better games, 3 Faster games and 3 Stronger, all will be in the same group of 8 players.

The top 4 from each group will go to the next stage, making it 32 players.

What I understand from this is that 4 players that get the most points in their group will advance to the next stage (this is why I don't think general scoretable helps with anything here).

We repeat this procedure again to get it down to 16, and once more to get it down to 8 - the final round.

What I understand from this is that the players that advanced to the second stage will be devided to new groups of 8 and will play 3 Harder games, 3 Better games, 3 Faster games and 3 Stronger again, and again it will be the top 4 scores of their group to advance to the next stage.

Round 1 - Harder
Scoring:
The good ole 'who got knocked out when' method. Knocked out first means you finish 8th, win the game you finish 1st.

I think there was a guy in my group that understood it a little different, What I understand from this is that the player that get knocked out first in their group game will finish 8th and the one who won that group game will be the one to finish first (and not the first to be knocked out in all of that round games finish last, that would be 64th, and the one who wins their group last, datewise, is the first one)

Round 2 - Better
Scoring:
Winner automatically comes first, and decides who comes second. Second place then decides who comes third, and so on all the way down to 6th place who decides the wooden spooners (they both get 1pt). That's right folks - favouritism can play a part in this round.

I think that this one is pretty clear, like pick-up ball game, the one that wins choose his friends to get more points. Of course only in his group.

Round 3 - Faster
Scoring:
First player to eliminate someone else comes first, and the eliminated player comes 8th. Next eliminated player comes 7th. As for the player making the elimination, if they are not yet placed (ie - not 1st), they come 2nd. If they are already placed, 2nd is still up for grabs. Wash rinse repeat.

What I understand from this is that is that you better kill first, if not then second but KILL someone and you will get more points, anyway the faster you kill more points you get. Of course only in his group.

Round 4 - Stronger
Scoring:
Winner comes first. The 2nd through 8th place is worked out by totalling the number of armies each player has left at the end of the game. Loser with the highest amount of armies comes 2nd, next highest 3rd, and so on. The eliminated player obviously comes last with 1pt. (See below for ties)

I think that I will only repeat the words above cause I can't explain it any other (better) way.

Scoring range for a single player over the four rounds (ie 12 games) is 12 points minimum, 252 points maximum. An average score is about 81 points.

What I understand from this is that every player that plays 12 games (4 rounds of any stage) can get, if he come last or next to it in all games, 12 points or if he won all games 252 (21*12).
What also I understand from that is that scores rest between stages (each time it's what you did against this certain group of players)


One last thing about what you wrote... none of the players are mathematically eliminated after 2 games, even if a player came 8th in both first games he has 2 points, if he wins the 3rd game he now has 23 points, that score will put him in the top four scores of his group those he will advance, but anyway it's not the case.


One last thing that I wrote in the older thread, is that stephen wayne is a deadbeat and retired from the site... you should call a reserve in his spot

[e_i_pi]

bigreuben is interpreting the rules I wrote out correctly.

Basically, each group is separate, with each 8 players playing 12 games all together. They are scored for each game, and once the 12 games are up, the bottom half of each group is eliminated.

That brings it down to 32 players. These 32 are divided up into 4 groups of 8 players each. Each of those groups has scores reset to zero, and they all play 12 games each like before, with scoring like before.

Once those games are done, the bottom half of each group is eliminated, leaving 16 players, which form 2 groups. Same process here, leaving 8 players for the final group, winner takes all.

Of course, now that this is out of my hands, BA can run it how he wants.

EDIT: Freemiums should be equally distributed into groups. In the first stage, every group had 1 freemium, and I think 1 or 2 groups had 2 freemiums. Once stage two commences, the freemiums should be equally distributed again, with everyone else randomly distributed.

[Blitzaholic]

Bigreuben is right..

I agree, lets just keep it the same as e_i_pi had and shorten the fields.

Group A:
1. coded: ___________29 pts
2. killmanic: ________22 pts
3. Blitzaholic: _______16 pts
3. Artimis: _________16 pts
5. Jalapeno: _________9 pts
6. Hopscotcher: ______7 pts
7. Don 1: ____________6 pts
8. seamusvibe:_______ 3 pts

Group B:
1. John Price: ________29 pts
2. DBandit70: ________22 pts
3. R0k0v: ___________16 pts
4. InsomniaRed: _____14 pts
5. blakebowling: _____10 pts
6. alamo1234321: _____9 pts
7. DimnjacarStef:_____ 4 pts
7. pimphawks70: ______4 pts

and so on for the rest of the groups...the TOP 4 from each group advance, rest are eliminated, is how I understood it as well.

[BaldAdonis]

Basically, each group is separate, with each 8 players playing 12 games all together. They are scored for each game, and once the 12 games are up, the bottom half of each group is eliminated.

Once those games are done, the bottom half of each group is eliminated, leaving 16 players, which form 2 groups. Same process here, leaving 8 players for the final group, winner takes all.

I'm keeping with the stages part (ie we replay the same format with fewer people) but I'm going to randomize the groups again after every round. When they are fixed, you will probably end up with groups where 5 or more players are in the top half of the competition, and some will still be eliminated. On the flip side, you will bring along players who aren't up to par, just because they were lucky enough to be in an easy group. No free rides.

[bigreuben]

Well, now we are 64 next stage 32 after that 16 and 8... that is 3 different stages, you really believe that someone who got an "easy group" will survive all of that stages just to get to the finals, I mean just get there!!!
If someone gets an "easy group" he will only get to the second stage... not more, unless you believe that more then half of the players got an easy group.

Now I'll explain why I'm against this move: Let's say I'm playing better BETTER and FASTER and not so well HARDER and STRONGER, my strategy is to get as many points possible at my weakness and to get major points, now because of the group change I can get even worst players on my weakest and it doesn't matter what I get on my better settings I'll be in the next stage! or it can be the other way around I can get the best players in my stronger rounds and then I have practically no chance to advance.

What I'm trying to say is that it actually puts more on the lucky side of a draw then on the strategy of a group.

[BaldAdonis]

What I'm trying to say is that it actually puts more on the lucky side of a draw then on the strategy of a group.

No, it doesn't. Your scenario is anecdotal, it doesn't describe what would actually happen to most players. Statistically, shuffling decreases the number of under-qualified players who advance.

[Keellan]

Still waiting on 1 in group D

[BaldAdonis]

Still waiting on 1 in group D

I just got this message from him this morning, in response to a reminder:

i resign from any tournament sign ups.

So I'll call up a reserve, and it should start soon.

[bigreuben]

so now it's only group G that is still waiting for the last one....

[bigreuben]

as I write this, there is only one more game left playable in this round... I think it would be nice if we can see how the scoreboard changed with all this games that are over now...

[skillfusniper33]

ok Group G's game has finished. And I (Skillfusniper33) Is the winner. Well played by all the other players in that game.
Game 4244107

[lhcguy]

Group F game is finished, grats to godd

[lhcguy]

Our game is still not filled.. when will we start?