Free Speech? Where?

[Serbia]

Write a song, go to jail.
This isn't China.

[Night Strike]

Interesting. I do, at the very least, think people should be more responsible for what they write/sing. So many rap songs do contain language condoning violence, abuse of women, and other words that could be seen to be inciting violence.

[Johnny Rockets]

Yeah, although I dislike the medium you should not be doing two years for that shit.

JR

[PLAYER57832]

The medium aside, I believe in this case he was not only making specific threats against police, but was encouraging and justifying it.

It is borderline, but more like the old "crying fire in a crowded theater". There are plenty of ways for him to express dislike, even disdain for police without advocating killing cops.

[demonfork]

The medium aside, I believe in this case he was not only making specific threats against police, but was encouraging and justifying it.

It is borderline, but more like the old "crying fire in a crowded theater". There are plenty of ways for him to express dislike, even disdain for police without advocating killing cops.

Borderline!??? You can't be serious. If this where to have gone to court it would have been thrown out, the only reason why he got the 2 years was because of the guys retarded plea of "no contest".


His rhyme was an artistic expression that is protected by the 1st amendment. If I painted a picture of cops getting murdered should I go to prison. If I made a movie about cops getting murdered should I go to prison? If I wrote a book about cops getting murdered should I go to prison?

This case is bullshit on every level. If you care about your freedom you should fight these kinds of bullshit attacks on our personal freedoms.

[demonfork]

The dude had no representation, he made a plea of "no contest" to this bullshit charge. If he'd of had a good lawyer like Sublime or NWA he would be a free man today


Sublime...

"screaming 187 on a mother-fucking cop"

no prison


NWA...

"Ice Cube will swarm
On any muthafucka in a blue uniform
Just cuz I'm from the CPT, punk police are afraid of me
A young nigga on a warpath
And when I'm finished, it's gonna be a bloodbath
Of cops, dyin in LA
Yo Dre, I got somethin to say"

no prison

[Woodruff]

The medium aside, I believe in this case he was not only making specific threats against police, but was encouraging and justifying it.

It is borderline, but more like the old "crying fire in a crowded theater". There are plenty of ways for him to express dislike, even disdain for police without advocating killing cops.

Borderline!??? You can't be serious. If this where to have gone to court it would have been thrown out, the only reason why he got the 2 years was because of the guys retarded plea of "no contest".

Exactly right. His idiotic plea is what killed him here. Where the hell was his lawyer?

[PLAYER57832]

The medium aside, I believe in this case he was not only making specific threats against police, but was encouraging and justifying it.

It is borderline, but more like the old "crying fire in a crowded theater". There are plenty of ways for him to express dislike, even disdain for police without advocating killing cops.

Borderline!??? You can't be serious. If this where to have gone to court it would have been thrown out, the only reason why he got the 2 years was because of the guys retarded plea of "no contest".

Exactly right. His idiotic plea is what killed him here. Where the hell was his lawyer?

I admit I have never seen the lyrics. Maybe I got the case mixed up with another or maybe that was what the news reported (not NPR in this case, I am remembering network news reports).

[MeDeFe]

I found the lyrics.

http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/story.as ... 82&catid=8

And I have to say, if you can get 2 years for that I know a few bands that should've gotten 20.

[PLAYER57832]

I found the lyrics.

http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/story.as ... 82&catid=8

And I have to say, if you can get 2 years for that I know a few bands that should've gotten 20.

Actually, its a bit worse than I thought. Not only are the lyrics saying he is going to kill a cop, but he threatens a specific officer.

I don't know enough about general punishments to know if 2 years is excessive or not. I would say that the song should not be sold, etc. unless modified and that money from it should be given to charities (maybe families of officers killed while on duty or some such). I would also hold the publisher accountable, not just the singer.

[MeDeFe]

I don't know about that, the threats look quite hypothetical to me, exaggeration is a legitimate method in any form of art and unless he had acquired a gun, mapped the officers' day-to-day movements and scouted out good spots for shooting them I don't think there is much of a case. It takes quite a lot before thoughtcrime becomes an actual crime imo.

[jonka]

Big brother is listening to your thoughtcrimes.

[jay_a2j]

This isn't China.

No, but we're getting there.

[hwhrhett]

they'll get him out of jail, and then he'll make a million bucks off of the publicity, or he'll do two years and have immediate street-cred, and join 50-cents posse, its the american dream, this guy knows what he is doing....

[Woodruff]

I don't know about that, the threats look quite hypothetical to me, exaggeration is a legitimate method in any form of art and unless he had acquired a gun, mapped the officers' day-to-day movements and scouted out good spots for shooting them I don't think there is much of a case. It takes quite a lot before thoughtcrime becomes an actual crime imo.

Unfortunately, it's getting less and less...as this example shows.

[MeDeFe]

I don't know about that, the threats look quite hypothetical to me, exaggeration is a legitimate method in any form of art and unless he had acquired a gun, mapped the officers' day-to-day movements and scouted out good spots for shooting them I don't think there is much of a case. It takes quite a lot before thoughtcrime becomes an actual crime imo.

Unfortunately, it's getting less and less...as this example shows.

But that's not my opinion of how it should be.

[Woodruff]

I don't know about that, the threats look quite hypothetical to me, exaggeration is a legitimate method in any form of art and unless he had acquired a gun, mapped the officers' day-to-day movements and scouted out good spots for shooting them I don't think there is much of a case. It takes quite a lot before thoughtcrime becomes an actual crime imo.

Unfortunately, it's getting less and less...as this example shows.

But that's not my opinion of how it should be.

I certainly agree (thus, my "unfortunately").

[MeDeFe]

I don't know about that, the threats look quite hypothetical to me, exaggeration is a legitimate method in any form of art and unless he had acquired a gun, mapped the officers' day-to-day movements and scouted out good spots for shooting them I don't think there is much of a case. It takes quite a lot before thoughtcrime becomes an actual crime imo.

Unfortunately, it's getting less and less...as this example shows.

But that's not my opinion of how it should be.

I certainly agree (thus, my "unfortunately").

Ah, I see, you were referring to RL, I thought you meant my opinion. No, not really.

[AgentSmith88]

they'll get him out of jail, and then he'll make a million bucks off of the publicity, or he'll do two years and have immediate street-cred, and join 50-cents posse, its the american dream, this guy knows what he is doing....

totally agree. he was a no-name and now he's in the news. he gets instant street cred for saying he's going to kill some cops and now will sell more than the 40 cds out of the back of his van he did before getting locked up.

[Rustovitch]

"These were specific threats made to specific people for all the world to hear," Assistant State Attorney Chip Thullbery said.

That about sums it up.
If you make general violent comments in a 'angsty' rap song you get away with it, if you make specific threats against specific people you should go to jail. You can't use the defence of 'oh but I am edgy angsty rapper with a chip on my shoulder rebelling against the man'.

[KuppenTruppen]

I don't know about 2 years, but this guy did break the law by issuing death threats. I mean, if someone you knew said they were going to kill you, not off the top of their head, but actually took the time to write a song about it, wouldn't you be concerned?

[MeDeFe]

I don't know about 2 years, but this guy did break the law by issuing death threats. I mean, if someone you knew said they were going to kill you, not off the top of their head, but actually took the time to write a song about it, wouldn't you be concerned?

As long as they're writing songs they're not killing me.

[Army of GOD]

Wouldn't you be allowed to press charges if anyone every made a death threat like that against you?

[PLAYER57832]

Wouldn't you be allowed to press charges if anyone every made a death threat like that against you?

Yes, but threats against police officers generally hold much more weight, because it is viewed as a threat to the institution of law enforcement, not just a personal issue.

[KuppenTruppen]

I don't know about 2 years, but this guy did break the law by issuing death threats. I mean, if someone you knew said they were going to kill you, not off the top of their head, but actually took the time to write a song about it, wouldn't you be concerned?

As long as they're writing songs they're not killing me.

And you completely missed the point. This musician was advocating the murder of a local police officer. Why? Because he fulfilled his duty by arresting a criminal, who happened to be affiliated with the musician. People cannot be allowed to freely threaten or attack those sworn to protect us, simply because they are protecting us. Why do you think there are laws in place for this contingency? Do you know what happens when police cannot or will not fulfill their duties, whether because they are dead, afraid for their lives, or on someone else's payroll? This is why we prosecute people who threaten the ability of our Law Enforcement to protect us.