sunrise in Paradise.

[Raskholnikov]

Looks great!

To bring parrishes into play, we could adopt the following bonus system in addition to the one we already have:

any 4 parrishes: +2
any 6 parrishes: +3
any 8 parrishes: +4
any 10 parrishes: +5

This meshes well with the regional bonus system we have. If you like it, then I would try to write the parrishes's names in wider, fainter, letters on the background of each parrish. It might be worth it to try just to see what it would look like - not too much work, I think...

Great work, pork!

[natty dread]

If you do that, then you should change cornwall's bonus into +2 at least, because by holding cornwall you also hold 5 parishes. You would get the +2 extra, that would make the bonus +4 total.

[Raskholnikov]

You're right. Cornwall would need to go down to +2 to keep it all balanced. Thanks!

[natty dread]

Also, E. middlesex should maybe get a +6 bonus, since it has lots of territories but only 2 parishes.

[porkenbeans]

Click image to enlarge.

small version 3.

How about something like this.
Also I moved the road around by runaway bay, to make room for another element, such as a radio tower or something.

[Raskholnikov]

Great! Please reduce the Cornwall bonus to +2.

[Tisha]

another one who doesn't like Jamaica as like 15 small islands.. if you want focus on the roads n stuff.. those big ole gaps are not the way to go

[mibi]

have you ever been to Jamaica?

[Raskholnikov]

Those big ole gaps aren't roads... they're the parrish borders.. the roads are the bevelled lines connecting cities...

Any yes, it's different from the standard cartographic maps you usually find here.... but somehow it works...

Pork, did you try writing out each parrish name in thicker, faded-out letters? Just to see how it would look?

[porkenbeans]

another one who doesn't like Jamaica as like 15 small islands.. if you want focus on the roads n stuff.. those big ole gaps are not the way to go

The island mass itself is a stylized representation of Jamaica. That is why there is no attempt to show the mountains or rivers and such. The "15 small islands", (actually there are 13 parishes shown), are shown without using the traditional lines that you would find on most maps. Instead I have chosen to show the parishes as separate pieces of the same puzzle. Thus, no need for artificial lines overlapped onto this map.

PS. Have you ever seen the USA map ?
What are all those islands about. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

[grifftron]

PS. Have you ever seen the USA map ?
What are all those islands about. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

That's a good point...

[the.killing.44]

PS. Have you ever seen the USA map ?
What are all those islands about. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

That's a good point...

Not really. On the USA map, the "islands" represent the bonus regions, and make for easy distinction. Here, well it's just plain confusing, as there are in-parrish separations and islands with circles from more than one continent in them.

[captainwalrus]

Here they represent parishes which are bonuses too, so it is a bit similar.

[captainwalrus]

Also, YOU NEED TO PUT THE MOST RECENT VERSION OF THE MAP ON THE FIRST POST!!!!

[Raskholnikov]

Here, well it's just plain confusing, as there are in-parrish separations and islands with circles from more than one continent in them.

Err.... no. There are no in-parrish separations, nor "islands" with circles from more than one continent on them" (whatever that may mean - talk about being confused and confusing!).

There are 3 regions, composed of both cities and parrishes. Each parrish and each city belongs to one and only one region. It follows that all cities located in one parrish belong to one region only - as shown by the color of their circle and name-tag. You get a region bonus by holding all cities (and therefore parrishes) within that region. You can also get bonuses by holding 4, 6, or 8 parrishes anywhere on the map. Since you hold a parrish by holding all cities on it, you cannot have cities on one parrish belonging to 2 different regions.

The same bonus system applies to the new England map (except it uses only counties, no cities at all). We use cities because there are not enough parrishes to make the game truly playable, and we use parrishes because we want to illustrate the island's actual administrative structure and because this is a good way to give bonuses to players who have at least 4 parrishes but not yet a region - given that Surrey has only 3 parrishes in its region. These are very simple rules: bonuses for holding all cities within a region, bonuses for holding a number of parrishes. What is so tough and confusing to understand -especially when you compare with some other maps out there that require a detailed study of rules, game play, bonus structures etc?

[RjBeals]

If you confuse 1 person in the foundry, you're going to confuse hundreds in the rest of the site. You need to make sure the map is simple and clear. You should by no means have to post explanations in this thread about layouts or bonus regions. I realize this map is still in development of course.

[isaiah40]

I kinda like the map, it's different and I like different. Although I agree that those large gaps between the parishes are a little big. How about compromise a little and reduce those gaps say by 50%? Hopefully that will make a difference in the way the map looks and feels, and still portrays what you want the map to be

P.S. How about cleaning up the top right side? It's getting a little cramped and losing the feel you want. Take out the Jamaican Coat of Arms or the Jamaican thing-a-ma-jig (sorry brain lapse). Instead of using the helicopters, how about using a Heliport symbol? That will clean it up a little. Just my 4 cents worth

[jpcloet]

I'd scale down the helicopters.

[Raskholnikov]

f you confuse 1 person in the foundry, you're going to confuse hundreds in the rest of the site. You need to make sure the map is simple and clear. You should by no means have to post explanations in this thread about layouts or bonus regions. I realize this map is still in development of course.

I agree in principle, but based on this logic, any one person could claim to be confused just to stall a project for reasons totally unrelated with it.

I mean, are you confused? By what? Just look at the map. You get bonuses for holding all cities of the same color. Crystal clear.
You get bonuses for holding 4, 6 o4 8 parrishes as indicated by the mini-map. Also super clear.

So where is the problem - unless one deliberately chooses to be obtuse?

In other words, Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? (Who guards these guardians)? And how deferrential are map-makers supposed to be to a self-selected group of people who are accountable for their comments and decisions to... err.... themselves???

In short: explain to us what exactly confuses you, don't just state that you are confused then tell us we shouldnt have to explain anything to you here and all should be clear from the start with no need for explanations.... Otherwise we will become really confused as to the real reasons behind your confusion and your refusal to let us clear up your confusion because, well, it's too confusing already if we have to explain to you what confuses you in the first place!!

R

[jpcloet]

I'm going to agree and say that it is a bit confusing. Until you look at the map and the legend and see that a land "section" is considered a parish, then you get it. I would argue that most people find Waterloo confusing, yet it's complexity is part of what makes it great. This design is very much like Midkemdil in the line work. I would say move on, except maybe make Kingston's yellow circle more obvious since the text is white instead of yellow, and maybe make a note that Kingston belongs to yellow bonus area. Just to make it clearer where possible.

[porkenbeans]

44 is an ass. He has a personal vendetta against me for some reason. He has bushwhacked me wherever, and whenever he gets a chance. I am fed up with even trying to be cordial to the sob. GET THE HELL OUT OF MY THREAD. YOU ARE NOT WELCOMED HERE. And take your peanut gallery with you.

[the.killing.44]

AHH! PEOPLE WHO DON'T THINK MY MAP IS PERFECT! "GET THE HELL OUT OF MY THREAD."

[Raskholnikov]

Thanks JP that is very constructive.

[Raskholnikov]

Ahh Pork.... .44 is just a 15 year old high school kid...(really!); he doesn't know any better... Not worth the aggravation...

[the.killing.44]

You want to know what's really wrong with this? Fine. Then I'll shut up and "get the hell out of [your] thread."

1. The seal. Nudity. CC doesn't care if it's the coat of arms for a UN country; someone got a warning for posting Michelangelo's David.

2. Your title. Discriminatory. It may truly be the way they talk, but it's still stereotypical and a form of bigotry. Take out the "mon."

3. The first post. There is nothing in it, save "First draft " and a heavily outdated map.

4. Your attitude. It says in the Official Foundry Guidelines that "4. All sound advice must be followed unless a logical rebuttal by the cartographer or another member of the community is provided." Saying "because I can" and "because I like it that way" isn't a logical rebuttal.

5. Your key. What's so special about those four highlighted islands? You never actually define "parish."

6. Your gaps / islands. Gaps are too wide apart; there is no explanation of islands on the map—they are the parishes, right?

7. Your helicopters. Why are they the size of an island?

Get over yourself. mibi, WM, et al have offered many constructive and true criticisms you spar off with a wave of "ehh I don't like that."