Germany Revamp Competition - FINAL VOTE (page one)

[sully800]

I wish we could update entries after seeing all the others and getting unbiased criticism (because the critics don't know the map authors). Oh well, that's the fun of revamps I suppose!

[the.killing.44]

The way I see it, if you don't do a run-off after letting users vote for two options it ruins the whole point of the two-choice system.

[natty dread]

Indeed, a run-off should be implemented in the case that no maps get >50% of votes. Which seems to be the case here...

And, since people get to choose 2 maps to vote, it is only logical that there would be a run-off between the 2 most popular...

See, first round: "I get to choose two. well, I want the winner to be either this or this. (votes)"

Second round: "oh, it's a choise between x or y. well, if those are the options, my vote goes to x (votes)"

And thus, everyone will be happy forever!

[Incandenza]

I do like the idea of a run-off, especially given that two maps are running away with it. Only seems fair to let them go head-to-head unless one of them reaches a majority (which I doubt will happen).

[PepeAtila]

good job!!!

[WidowMakers]

The way I see it, if you don't do a run-off after letting users vote for two options it ruins the whole point of the two-choice system.

I do like the idea of a run-off, especially given that two maps are running away with it. Only seems fair to let them go head-to-head unless one of them reaches a majority (which I doubt will happen).

Agreed
Agreed

[Industrial Helix]

This might be a stupid question... but how is this poll being advertised?

I took a quick look around for an announcement outside of the foundry or even in general and found nothing... wasn't it not involving the rest of CC, at least the forums, one of the problems associated with dropping a new map on CC players?

I figure there should should be a general announcement saying its out there and polling is going on.

Or at least a thread in the discussion forum announcing that the map is going to be changed.

[the.killing.44]

This might be a stupid question... but how is this poll being advertised?

I took a quick look around for an announcement outside of the foundry or even in general and found nothing... wasn't it not involving the rest of CC, at least the forums, one of the problems associated with dropping a new map on CC players?

I figure there should should be a general announcement saying its out there and polling is going on.

Or at least a thread in the discussion forum announcing that the map is going to be changed.

http://www.conquerclub.com/public.php?mode=home

[Peter Gibbons]

I agree with the run-off both for the principles expressed above and the practicality of this particular contest.

To be frank, "F" (it seems to most) is the best map amongst several that use a very similar color scheme. "I" seems to be the best map (by far) of those that thought outside that color scheme box. But that means that voted for others may very well have "F" as a second, third or fourth choice and have "I" way down there list. In the end, if the voting stays similar to where it is ("I" about 7-10 points ahead of "F," but below 40%), I think a runoff is the smart and proper action.

[Evil DIMwit]

I agree with the run-off both for the principles expressed above and the practicality of this particular contest.

To be frank, "F" (it seems to most) is the best map amongst several that use a very similar color scheme. "I" seems to be the best map (by far) of those that thought outside that color scheme box. But that means that voted for others may very well have "F" as a second, third or fourth choice and have "I" way down there list. In the end, if the voting stays similar to where it is ("I" about 7-10 points ahead of "F," but below 40%), I think a runoff is the smart and proper action.

Agreed. There's not quite a clear favorite as it is.

[cairnswk]

The way I see it, if you don't do a run-off after letting users vote for two options it ruins the whole point of the two-choice system.

I do like the idea of a run-off, especially given that two maps are running away with it. Only seems fair to let them go head-to-head unless one of them reaches a majority (which I doubt will happen).

Agreed
Agreed

And thirdeded and fourthded...hick **** Happy New Year everyone.

Let's have shecond polllllllll. hick [bubbles from Scotch an coke affecting his spirits,,ha ha , the boss shouted us prawns and champagne for lunch today,,,]

[captainwalrus]

While the poll is pretty clear who is winning, I will post my thoughts just so people can learn from their mistakes.



Map B - I like the style, and like where your trying to go with it, but I see somethings I don't care for. The connector to Rugen, way to thick, it looks really out of place. Some of the text is a bit squished or stretched in places. The outline on the mountains is too solid for my taste, and it doesn't need to go on the bottom, since the bottom of a mountain just blends with the ground. I like the small horizontal lines going across, it gives it a neat feel, but is subtle and not overwhelming. I like the line thing for the army numbers, it goes well with the texture and graphics style.
On a scale from one to ten; In its current form, 3.5, Potential - 7
I think if you make a few things and go a bit further with the theme, it can work well, Nice job!

Map C - Colorful, I like it! I like the color on the land and I like the texture. I like the rivers, how they aren't just blue things that float off into nowhere. I don't like the mountains, they seem to m something you just cut out from a picture. Your better of making your own and using less detail, just make them the color of the region they are in or something The font is nice, not much style but crisp and clean. try to make the font size more consistent, even if that means making it smaller in a lot of paces where it could be bigger.
On a scale from one to ten; In its current form, 4, potential - 5.5
While I like it now, it doesn't have very far to go. It is nice and simple, and I like that, but that means that you can't improve very much. Good job though, I do like it!

Map D - I like it, the bevel works nice, and the texture is good too, but not overpowering. I love the mountains, especially the green ones, not many people bother to make their mountains different colors according to what they actually look like, nice going. It is nice, and simple, but not too simple. I don't think you need the army circles for this, the colors are fine so that the army numbers will be easily visible. Some of the sideways text is annoying, maybe just abbreviate, that will make it so that it fits well. I also like that it isn't just floating there, it is in some sort of context.
On a scale from one to ten; In its current form, 5, potential - 6.5
I don't see very far for you to go unfortunately, it is a nice map though!

Map E - Again, very clean, very crisp. I really like the rich colors, the texture, the mountains, and the borders are nice too. I don't have much to nitpick about this one.
Currently - 6.5, potential, 8
Great map!

Map F - This is amazing, great job. I am speechless. It looks like Poland looks like now, and this is just the first draft or so!
Currently 8.5, potential 9.5
Holy Shit!

Map G - Another clean crisp one, but I like this a lot. It has nice simple mountains (sort of the same as used in fractured america) but still good looking. I like using the forests as impassibles, that is a great idea and isn't used much, the pines look great. I like how the internal borders are nice and thin, they aren't overpowering at all.
Currently 6.5, potential 8

Map H - I hate it. Sorry, but it just looks bad. Too many rivers, to much green, too much brown, not enough Germany. You have so many rivers and so many river connections, it is all not needed! And Albert Einstein? Why is he there? So he is German, so are millions of other famous people! He is not associated with the country of Germany very often, and he is not associated with mapping. It looks like a bad map of the moon scrunched into a Germany shape and hung on the wall of a nuclear bunker (hence the green). The Minimap? So dull, and it doesn't tell people the names of bonus regions, which is usually something that has to be included.
Currently 2, potential, 3

Map I - Great map, it has really all been said before by other people, no need to go into the details.
Currently 8.5, potential 9.5


I voted for I and F

[natty dread]

And Albert Einstein? Why is he there? So he is German, so are millions of other famous people! He is not associated with the country of Germany very often, and he is not associated with mapping.

Albert Hofmann probably would have been a better choice...?

[AndyDufresne]

There were definitely some good entries. I narrowed it down to 4 that I liked:

Map A:
I was always a fan of this edition of Germany---it had a unique style that stood apart from other maps.

Map F:
A little too dark (dark maps stink) but I liked the visuals in this map.

Map G:
Simplistic, not too dark. Needs some work, but it is in my top 4.

Map I:
Obviously a unique style of graphics. I enjoyed the mix of mountains and water barriers.


--Andy

[Industrial Helix]

This might be a stupid question... but how is this poll being advertised?

I took a quick look around for an announcement outside of the foundry or even in general and found nothing... wasn't it not involving the rest of CC, at least the forums, one of the problems associated with dropping a new map on CC players?

I figure there should should be a general announcement saying its out there and polling is going on.

Or at least a thread in the discussion forum announcing that the map is going to be changed.

http://www.conquerclub.com/public.php?mode=home

Ah, I see it. Not my first place for looking for information but apparently it is for about 500 CCers.

[RUTHLESSNESS]

C

[sully800]

ya know, map I is now running away from it. I say no run off is necessary if this kind of lead remains.

Of course no map is going to get >50% of the vote since everyone was allowed 2 votes. That doesn't mean that map I is not the clear favorite.

[The Neon Peon]

ya know, map I is now running away from it. I say no run off is necessary if this kind of lead remains.

Of course no map is going to get >50% of the vote since everyone was allowed 2 votes. That doesn't mean that map I is not the clear favorite.

I'd like a run off. I voted for F and I, and I have no clue yet as to which I like more. And there are many other people that voted for both that could be in the same dilemma as myself.

I think that there can't be any harm in running a second poll between just the 2 maps.

[sully800]

ya know, map I is now running away from it. I say no run off is necessary if this kind of lead remains.

Of course no map is going to get >50% of the vote since everyone was allowed 2 votes. That doesn't mean that map I is not the clear favorite.

I'd like a run off. I voted for F and I, and I have no clue yet as to which I like more. And there are many other people that voted for both that could be in the same dilemma as myself.

I think that there can't be any harm in running a second poll between just the 2 maps.

Right. I understand the reasoning and that's fine. There's no harm (other than taking more time) but I'm pretty confident the runoff won't change anything. I'd be fine with having one, and it does ensure the fairest possible vote, but I don't personally think it is close enough to be necessary.

[cairnswk]

ya know, map I is now running away from it. I say no run off is necessary if this kind of lead remains.

Of course no map is going to get >50% of the vote since everyone was allowed 2 votes. That doesn't mean that map I is not the clear favorite.

I'd like a run off. I voted for F and I, and I have no clue yet as to which I like more. And there are many other people that voted for both that could be in the same dilemma as myself.

I think that there can't be any harm in running a second poll between just the 2 maps.

Right. I understand the reasoning and that's fine. There's no harm (other than taking more time) but I'm pretty confident the runoff won't change anything. I'd be fine with having one, and it does ensure the fairest possible vote, but I don't personally think it is close enough to be necessary.

Well, i think it would be interesting to see the outcome with only one option.
For all i know, the same 129 who voted for F, could easily have voted also for I, in this vote.
While the coutcome may be the same or similar, it solidifies the winner with only one choice to vote for.
That's my opinion anyways.

[the.killing.44]

ya know, map I is now running away from it. I say no run off is necessary if this kind of lead remains.

Of course no map is going to get >50% of the vote since everyone was allowed 2 votes. That doesn't mean that map I is not the clear favorite.

I'd like a run off. I voted for F and I, and I have no clue yet as to which I like more. And there are many other people that voted for both that could be in the same dilemma as myself.

I think that there can't be any harm in running a second poll between just the 2 maps.

Right. I understand the reasoning and that's fine. There's no harm (other than taking more time) but I'm pretty confident the runoff won't change anything. I'd be fine with having one, and it does ensure the fairest possible vote, but I don't personally think it is close enough to be necessary.

Well, i think it would be interesting to see the outcome with only one option.
For all i know, the same 129 who voted for F, could easily have voted also for I, in this vote.
While the coutcome may be the same or similar, it solidifies the winner with only one choice to vote for.
That's my opinion anyways.

I think that's exactly right. Basically, without a run-off then there's no point to the ability to select 2 options. In essence, this 2-option poll—in my mind—was, unless the result was ridiculously one-sided, to decide which two maps would partake in a run-off.

[porkenbeans]

ya know, map I is now running away from it. I say no run off is necessary if this kind of lead remains.

Of course no map is going to get >50% of the vote since everyone was allowed 2 votes. That doesn't mean that map I is not the clear favorite.

I'd like a run off. I voted for F and I, and I have no clue yet as to which I like more. And there are many other people that voted for both that could be in the same dilemma as myself.

I think that there can't be any harm in running a second poll between just the 2 maps.

Right. I understand the reasoning and that's fine. There's no harm (other than taking more time) but I'm pretty confident the runoff won't change anything. I'd be fine with having one, and it does ensure the fairest possible vote, but I don't personally think it is close enough to be necessary.

Well, i think it would be interesting to see the outcome with only one option.
For all i know, the same 129 who voted for F, could easily have voted also for I, in this vote.
While the coutcome may be the same or similar, it solidifies the winner with only one choice to vote for.
That's my opinion anyways.

I think that's exactly right. Basically, without a run-off then there's no point to the ability to select 2 options. In essence, this 2-option poll—in my mind—was, unless the result was ridiculously one-sided, to decide which two maps would partake in a run-off.

I agree with cairn, neon, and 44.

[Seulessliathan]

difficult to make a revamp for a map which includes some geographical nonsense like the imassable between Osnabrück - Münster. First person who sends me a photo of any impassable there will get my vote. So far , maps with rivers and hills there get my vote, that makes more sense than mountains, and i don´t have more major issues with these maps (D&I).
Name changes make sense on all maps, i don´t like the maps which are really dark.

[Lone.prophet]

difficult to make a revamp for a map which includes some geographical nonsense like the imassable between Osnabrück - Münster. First person who sends me a photo of any impassable there will get my vote. So far , maps with rivers and hills there get my vote, that makes more sense than mountains, and i don´t have more major issues with these maps (D&I).
Name changes make sense on all maps, i don´t like the maps which are really dark.

impassebles are for gameplay not geographicly most of the time.

btw i voted for I looked the best IMO but ofcourse some things could still improve, like the overdone old paper tone or the non matching german shield

[Seulessliathan]

impassebles are for gameplay not geographicly most of the time.

i have seen/played several maps now, and usually i believed that rivers/mountains really existed if it was a non-fiction map. Why should anyone add impassables where none exists? Gameplay would be different, but for all other maps, impassables didn´t come out of nowhere just for gameplay balance. And in this case (Germany map) i don´t see any reason given by gameplay for that strange impassable. I think it´s just geographical nonsense which can´t be undone because gameplay must be the same in revamp. Of course i could make a USA map , moving the Rookie Mountains to Florida .... but .... would that make sense? Would you agree with that if i say gameplay would be better after the change?