Koran burning will endanger US lives: Petraeus

[2dimes]

I never said he should do it, only that he can do it.


By the way, I've edited my generalization that got AAFitz and others upset towards me. Sorry about the over-generalization.

I'm not trying to make it seem like you said he should. I agree that he can, I'm just overstating my position that it's stupid to do it publicly on North American soil. I honestly think he should go somewhere else to do it. If God wants him to then God will protect him. I want him to show us that.

Instead of cowering at home, inciting the crazys and saying they didn't get him because God protected him.

I don't know maybe he wants to get killed so he can be a martyr. That's perfectly acceptable to me, in fact he has my full support wether he is directed by God or not. However if it leads to one innocent person getting killed I believe he's just as responsible as who ever does the physical deed.

okay, just to get things straight: does anyone here believe that the man should NOT be allowed to burn the koran?

Moslems would say so.

Not all Muslims would.

if so, how should he be stopped?

Education. It's the only way.

This is the only good long-term solution.

Ok, I'm convinced, go educate him.

[Woodruff]

okay, just to get things straight: does anyone here believe that the man should NOT be allowed to burn the koran?

Moslems would say so.

Not all Muslims would.

if so, how should he be stopped?

Education. It's the only way.

This is the only good long-term solution.

Ok, I'm convinced, go educate him.

Oh, I'd LOVE to "educate" him. In fact, I could come up with a darn quick lesson plan on the subject. I don't know if he'd learn, but it would be fun to find out. <evil smile>

But in all seriousness...can you think of a more effective, yet still morally decent, long-term solution?

[2dimes]

I wish I could but my opinion is that he probably has an education. Two problems, not all education is right and some dogs won't learn. Here's my response to it earlier.

if so, how should he be stopped?

Education. It's the only way.

Education and the rest of us not bowing down to the idiotic hateful rhetoric that seems to have become so widespread in our country of late.

So if I'm following correctly here basically. You...

think it's time for Christians, for churches, for politicians to stand up and say no;

And his behaviour...

is not welcome in the US."

Education, yeah that would super fix it. He should probably take religious studies and theology. Amirite?

[BigBallinStalin]

So in order to get people to stop desecrating the flag or the bible, I have to threaten them with widespread physical violence?

Brilliant. Freakin' brilliant.

And all this is proving is how freakin violent the supposed "religion of peace" is when their own symbols are being desecrated. You know what? f*ck you. Christians have had to endure it, but you don't see us going all batshit crazy around the world. Jews have had to endure it, but you don't see them trying to blow up everyone that comes within 1000 miles of them. And a lot of Americans have had to deal with the flag being burned, but we haven't threatened to go on a worldwide violence spree. So f*ck you assholes. Especially you, Al Qaida. Yeah you, you fucking assholes. Can't take any criticism? What are you, a bunch of little whiny bitches that throw temper tantrums and decide to blow up innocent people!? At least man-up and admit you're fucking murderers to people of your own religion who actually, believe it or not, want to live in PEACE! So go and die in a hole somewhere assholes.

Yeah, it's a frustrating situation, isn't it?

[john9blue]

No amount of education will prevent crazy people from doing crazy things, and it sure as hell won't prevent sane people from doing legal things.

[PLAYER57832]

The problem is that Moslems see the K'ran as something "super holy" and any defiling of the book is to defile their religion. Does that mean we have to honor those beliefs? Only to the extent they don't intefere with our own constitution and beliefs. Trickier is that this act might well endanger troops because the extreme groups in Afghanistan and elsewhere will take this and use it.

The Taliban will kill American soldiers simply for being in that region because we took away their power to rule and enslave. If captured, they might blame it on American extremists burning the Koran, but I have a feeling it's safe to bet 99% of them would have been attacking American troops anyway. It's just another tool for the Taliban to attempt to justify their own actions of violence and oppression, but all attempts at justification do not take away from the fact that they are simply after power for themselves.

No Nighstrike, I spoke of MOSLEMS, you spoke only of the Taliban. And your insistance that there is no distinction is a big part of the PROBLEM.

You want to defeat the Taliban? Support MODERATE Moslems.

[PLAYER57832]

Ok, I'm convinced, go educate him.

Oh, I'd LOVE to "educate" him. In fact, I could come up with a darn quick lesson plan on the subject. I don't know if he'd learn, but it would be fun to find out. <evil smile>

But in all seriousness...can you think of a more effective, yet still morally decent, long-term solution?

There is an old song from the civil rights days that goes something like "they have to be carefully taught." We are never going to eradicate all jerks. They just change the subject matter. However, we can go a long way to ensure that the idiocy is reigned in somewhat.

It may not seem like much, but a generation ago, it would not necessarily have been books they were burning. That is not perfection, but it IS progress.

[Woodruff]

I wish I could but my opinion is that he probably has an education. Two problems, not all education is right and some dogs won't learn. Here's my response to it earlier.

True enough that "not all education is right", but if you're trying to teach someone "to do the right thing", it doesn't really make sense to do so by teaching them in a way that is NOT "doing the right thing". Sort of like teaching a child not to hit other kids by giving them a spanking.

As to his already having an education...I strongly suspect he DOESN'T have an education in "winning hearts and minds" (though as a religious leader, one would hope he would have)...at least based on what little I know of him. Being educated doesn't mean that you're educated in everything.

[Woodruff]

No amount of education will prevent crazy people from doing crazy things, and it sure as hell won't prevent sane people from doing legal things.

I would say that SOMETIMES, education won't help (you can't educate those who refuse to be educated)...but that's certainly not a hard and fast rule at all.

[PLAYER57832]

Education, yeah that would super fix it. He should probably take religious studies and theology. Amirite?

If he really studied theology, religious studies and not just single dogma, it would go a LONG way.

[PLAYER57832]

I wish I could but my opinion is that he probably has an education. Two problems, not all education is right and some dogs won't learn. Here's my response to it earlier.

True enough that "not all education is right", but if you're trying to teach someone "to do the right thing", it doesn't really make sense to do so by teaching them in a way that is NOT "doing the right thing". Sort of like teaching a child not to hit other kids by giving them a spanking.

As to his already having an education...I strongly suspect he DOESN'T have an education in "winning hearts and minds" (though as a religious leader, one would hope he would have)...at least based on what little I know of him. Being educated doesn't mean that you're educated in everything.

In my experience the true spiritual leaders often work well with other leaders on important issues. Its those just a bit further down the ranks that give the trouble, for this very reason and for some that perhaps go a bit deeper (not going to make this another faith thread).

[PLAYER57832]

As an aside, I heard one of the most interesting arguments against this burning on my local conservative Christian radio station. Namely, that this would impede people reaching out to convert Moslems. Stepping on someone's religion is not a very effective way to get htem to listen to you.

[2dimes]

Education, yeah that would super fix it. He should probably take religious studies and theology. Amirite?

If he really studied theology, religious studies and not just single dogma, it would go a LONG way.

Him actually being involved and studying to learn something is ≠ to "Education". Even though you're correct in thinking it is supposed to be.

[AAFitz]

Actually after just having read this, I have to agree, teaching this guy anything is not going to happen.

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-s ... at-burnies

He is either, delusional or stupid. there is no other way to see it.

Warning: Youll have to put up with a joke or two to get to the quote Im referring to. Im sure I could have found it elsewhere, but...well, you get to laugh as well.

[2dimes]

They won't let me watch it from there in Canuckistan.

[AAFitz]

They won't let me watch it from there in Canuckistan.

Long story short: The pastor believes that moderate Muslims should, and will be on board of their koran burning, since it is the extremists, their act is meant to admonish.

The interviewer says its silly. His defense; "No, its not silly." I took that to mean he was senile and delusional, but in his defense, he really could just be that stupid. Either way, I think its clear he's past education. Anyone that listens to him, by default, is really just as crazy or stupid.

At least hes just burning books. God knows what a psycho like this might do with a little more power. Luckily, his ability is limited to burning paper with fire. Clearly, understanding whats written on it has long since left his abilities, assuming its the Bible he preaches from every Sunday.

[Woodruff]

They won't let me watch it from there in Canuckistan.

Long story short: The pastor believes that moderate Muslims should, and will be on board of their koran burning, since it is the extremists, their act is meant to admonish.

Yeah, that's pretty damn stupid.

Gotta say though...I am a bit jealous of the mustache.

[muy_thaiguy]

So in order to get people to stop desecrating the flag or the bible, I have to threaten them with widespread physical violence?

Brilliant. Freakin' brilliant.

And all this is proving is how freakin violent the supposed "religion of peace" is when their own symbols are being desecrated. You know what? f*ck you. Christians have had to endure it, but you don't see us going all batshit crazy around the world. Jews have had to endure it, but you don't see them trying to blow up everyone that comes within 1000 miles of them. And a lot of Americans have had to deal with the flag being burned, but we haven't threatened to go on a worldwide violence spree. So f*ck you assholes. Especially you, Al Qaida. Yeah you, you fucking assholes. Can't take any criticism? What are you, a bunch of little whiny bitches that throw temper tantrums and decide to blow up innocent people!? At least man-up and admit you're fucking murderers to people of your own religion who actually, believe it or not, want to live in PEACE! So go and die in a hole somewhere assholes.

Yeah, it's a frustrating situation, isn't it?

You have no idea.

[Snorri1234]

I don't get it, why should we even care what some wacko does with his books?

[Nobunaga]

... The burning's off. MOve along, nothing to see here.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/pastor-terry-j ... d=11594495

[notyou2]

feckin whackos

[Woodruff]

I don't get it, why should we even care what some wacko does with his books?

Because it will inflame those who would do us harm. Well, not you.

[saxitoxin]

Muslims protest plans to burn the Koran in Multan, PK, September 9.


http://www.reuters.com/news/pictures/sl ... lide=2#a=2

[HapSmo19]

Muslims protest plans to burn the Koran in Multan, PK, September 9.


http://www.reuters.com/news/pictures/sl ... lide=2#a=2

Well look at that....it's the Pakistanis Who've Been Denied An American Visa Support Group.

Nice sig by the way
Have you heard about how smart MENSA thinks she is?

[MeDeFe]

I don't get it, why should we even care what some wacko does with his books?

Because it will inflame those who would do us harm. Well, not you.

I thought the point was that rather than setting people ablaze he only does so so with his books.