Cairns Coral Coast [Quenched] - Loaded!

Guiscard · Post by **Guiscard** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 9:55 am

I'm not keen on the photo for the background of the title. Seems out of place as the rest of the map is in a hand-drawn style. Would rather see something else.

onbekende · Post by **onbekende** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 10:28 am

*advice person enters*

My advise, your thought about implementing them

Switch "The Swamps" with "The Beaches" so you go zig zag over the continents in the legend.

Delete that "Tableland Rises" you are going to confuse people with they thinking it is 1 way.

Whats the deal with the palm trees?

The Beaches:
Perhaps a bonus of 2, seeing you need 2 to hold it, I know it has 7 territories, but still.

The Swamps:
Good

Agate Hills:
good

Fruit Pickers:
Bonus 5, its central, but don't over do it.

Rainforest:
perhaps this needs a boost to 5? but I think better not.

City Estate:
good

Maize Silos:
good

Dairy Farmers:
7?? (I dunno).

Sugarland:
perhaps only a 4, is kinda out of the center, a bit away, also when taking the whole south-east, you need to give other players still some change.

Bananaland:
make that river completly towards those southern mountains

thanks

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 10:33 am

Guiscard, thanks for responding.
I don't think it out of place

since it is a photo of the Frankland Islands on the map, perhaps of all the mentioned islands the most closely associated with coral atols. I understand that it might seem out of place with the rest of the map, but have you heard about "artistry", combining two mediums to create a style. You do it in your signature block. And I think the map would be too overcrowded if it was within the boundaries of the hand drawn elements itself.
Cheers!

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 10:34 am

cairnswk wrote:Andy....Is this the preferred bridge, and background for the title?

yep this is the right bridge.

also i have a problem. between Mena Creek and Nerada there's a river with a bridge but shouldn't the river go all the way to the mountains? at the moment there are a few pixels of normal border making the bridge redundant.

several minor things:
* move moreeba army shadow a little lower
* replace Is with Isle or Island or at least add a dot to Is.
* you have little waves on mitchel swamps lake. maybe add that waves to the lakes in the center.
* replace the photo in the title box. either make it a simple colour fill or put a drawing. that photo does not belong there.
* use the same pale blue for the lower box margins as you used for the top right one.
* this one is a bit trickier depending on you layers but you could try using several shades of brown for the mountains.
* the bridges. is it one copy pasted image or are they different? the saddle Mtn-Kuranda bridge looks a bit shaky compared to Tolga - Rocky Ck one.
* Lotus Glen Prison text has a different glow compared to the other names on the Fruit Pickers region.
* i can't really tell the difference between a and o.

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 11:24 am

18Mar V16 Update - Various fixes

* Mena Crk extended to mountains
* Mareeba army shadow moved
* Punkt or fullstop places after Is for Island in text
* Lotus glen Prison glow rectified
* Kuranda bridge duplicated from Mareeba bridge and skewed
* Title box outside rim consistent with other legend
* Army shadow boxes re-sized to 23 px

I think we all have the same problems at times between Os and As

PLEASE NOTE PEOPLE: STAYING ON THE MAP ARE:
Tableland Rise
PalmTrees
Waterfalls

Thank you for your comments!

Gozar · Post by **Gozar** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 11:44 am

Your map is looking good!
Can't wait to see it with numbers!

Cheers,
Gozar

onbekende · Post by **onbekende** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 11:54 am

I think you want those tables and trees for good old country sake? but it doesn't really do anything and can even start people questioning why they are there

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 6:38 pm

Howdy All....Below is a test for the army numbers on the shadows as suggested by Gozar....thanks Gozar.

For a small map with 60 territories, the spread of numbers looks good and uncluttered i.e. they don't look as though they are sitting ontop of each other.

Thanks also Obekende for your comments...far be from me to leave something there simply for good old country sake. I'm sure players will get over whatever issues arise from those challenges.

Gozar · Post by **Gozar** » Sat Mar 17, 2007 10:25 pm

I like it!
Center your numbers.

That is all I can say.
Gozar

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 1:36 am

Large Map army shadow testing below......

Marvaddin · Post by **Marvaddin** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 12:02 pm

Very interesting map. Im surprised, because its my first look at this one... But I like it.

The legend could still be improved, I think. The word regions is not needed. Also, you could add some people, and sharks in the water

But I like your graphs.

I will start to discuss the bonuses:
The swamps - 5 territories, 3 borders, 3 attack routes. Bonus 3 is ok.
The beachs - 7 territories, 2 borders, 2 attack routes. Bonus 3.
Agate hills - 5, 2, 2 - Bonus 2 (but I dislike the way its linear; maybe open Dimbulah to Rocky Ck, and adjust bonus to 3)
Fruit pickers - 7, 4, 4 - Bonus should be 4, maybe 5, at maximum. Surely not 6, even why you can grab Agate hills without increase number of borders...
Rainforest - 5, 4, 4. 4 borders, but you can reduce to 3 just getting Tinaroo... So it can become a 6, 3, 4... alike to Africa in classic. I would give it a 3, with a 4 to Fruit pickers.
City Estates - 5, 2, 3... surely a 2. But Im a bit worried about this one plus beachs becoming a very powerfull area...
Maize Silos - 7, 5, 6 - As it is now, surely a 5, with Fruit being a 4. But I strongly suggest remove the bridge between Atherton and The Lakes. In this case, you can use the same bonus to this area and Fruit.
Dairy Farmers - 7, 6, 7 - Very difficult to hold. Beyond remove the Atherton Lakes bridge, maybe you could block Malanda from being attacked from Crater. Or at least remove the bridge, and have it as a bonus of 5 (with Fruit and Silos as 4).
Sugarland - 7, 4, 5 - Again, not 5, but 4.
Bananaland - 5, 2, 3 - Surely a 2.

Just thinking... It was on purpose you have 5 continents with 5 territories, and 5 with 7 territories? In this case, really most bonuses will be alike.

boberz · Post by **boberz** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:34 pm

could you decrease circle size slightly?? if you could that might make it look neater (but dont let qwert near this thread if you do)

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:37 pm

Boberz, thanks for the feedback....yes the circles auto increased with the size of the large map, so yes they will be down-sized.

Marvaddin, thanks for the tips on the bonuses. These are, as I understand it, the next examination piece off-the-block, so your options will be on the agenda.

Samus · Post by **Samus** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:07 pm

Marv,

As a big part of making the bonuses what they are, I thought I'd give you the reasoning behind some of the things you pointed out.

Agate Hills was made linear on purpose, very similar to Land's End on the British Isles map, only with 1 more territory and 1 more border. I guess I don't really understand why one region being linear is automatically bad, but if a lot of people have a problem with it, the opening from Mitchell River can be moved to Wolfram or Dimbulah. Still 5 territories with 2 borders, no longer linear. Again, I like the fact that it's linear, so more discussion is probably needed here.

Fruit Pickers has 7 territories with 4 borders, but it is in the middle of the map and borders 4 different regions. In this respect, it is identical to Athens in the Ancient Greece map. It's pretty rare that someone holds Athens because the players surrounding will not allow it to happen. I would think that rather than taking Fruit Pickers and then moving on to Agate Hills, the person who goes for Agate Hills will make sure you never hold that bonus. I certainly wouldn't go for this region first, would you?

Rainforest had much the same reasoning, it's in the middle bordering 4 regions and therefore much harder to hold. That's a big part of why it's +4 instead of +3. It's very similar to Midlands in the Ireland map, only with more territories.

Maize Silos, you should probably expand on your suggestion to remove the bridge to The Lakes and reduce the bonus rather than leave it as is.

Dairy Farmers is what it is, it's a larger region that as you say is very difficult to hold. Most maps have one, Dairy Farmers is it in this map. There's 10 regions so it's not like there's a shortage of positions to go for at start.

Sugarland has 7 territories with 4 borders to 3 regions, it's exactly like Europe in the Classic map. It is actually more difficult to hold than most +5 bonuses in other maps, but maybe I'm missing something.

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 12:42 pm

Samus, would it be an idea to put the bonuses to the vote, or is that only delaying the process?

Lone.prophet · Post by **Lone.prophet** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:03 pm

this map has like no overview, maybe add some borders countries it would really help. now it is just a full square with a blue/water area to the right

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:23 pm

Thanks Lone.Prophet
Countries are as per the legend...not real countries, but rather districts on a real map....real places.
Their colour as well as several borders should be differentiating enough to distinguish which one is which.

Lone.prophet · Post by **Lone.prophet** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:25 pm

only i lose the overiew without some sort of border in this map.

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:29 pm

Lone.prophet wrote:only i lose the overiew without some sort of border in this map.

Lone.Prophet...please explain further.
* Are u talking about the large or small map, and
* which borders are u refering to?

Lone.prophet · Post by **Lone.prophet** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:32 pm

not the countries border border of the hole map, it just ands at the right side maybe make a grey area there or some sort of flow from map ---> neutral something ----> end of map

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:39 pm

I think I got U...thanx!

Samus · Post by **Samus** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 2:17 pm

cairnswk wrote:Samus, would it be an idea to put the bonuses to the vote, or is that only delaying the process?

That assumes we think the majority of people have a good understanding of how these things will actually play out in a real game just by looking at the map. I don't really have confidence in that.

Marv has an excellent understanding of this, and obviously Andy does too. I'm sure we can discuss it out. We might wind up having a poll for one specific bonus that we don't all agree on, but we aren't there yet.

Jack0827 · Post by **Jack0827** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 3:05 pm

I like it

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 3:17 pm

Marv has an excellent understanding of this, and obviously Andy does too. I'm sure we can discuss it out. We might wind up having a poll for one specific bonus that we don't all agree on, but we aren't there yet.

Thanks Samus, as always, excellent advice.

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 3:18 pm

Jack0827 wrote:I like it

Much appreciated Jack0827.