The War of the Triple Crown

[natty dread]

I would make the land areas larger.

[tkr4lf]

Ok, well, now that I know the actual size I need the map to be, let me go in and resize it and see how it looks then.

Then I can increase the size of the land, but I'd still like to keep them sort of proportional to what they are now. I could probably fit in more territs as well.

The only thing about increasing the land size, I don't where the legend is going to go as is, so with even more land occupying the map, it seems it will be even harder to get a legend in there somewhere.

[natty dread]

That's just it... with so much sea between them, you're wasting space.

I would suggest merging islands 5, 6 and 9 into one bigger island. Then move all of the islands closer together. You could also stretch the whole map slightly height-wise: currently, your map is too wide, the maximum width for regular maps is 840. On the other hand, you could have lots more height (maximum is 800).

Then you can add the legend to either the upper or lower edge.

[tkr4lf]

I could try merging 5, 6 and 7...

I would really rather not merge island 9 with anything...that's meant to be a key part of the objective win, with the biggest autodeploy located there, and a (pretty much) central position in relation to the 3 different empires, with attack paths going to all three.

I'm not against merging, but would really rather not mess with 9 too much.

Edit: However, I'm not 100% opposed to it. If you could provide an alternative for what I want to use 9 for, then 9 could be merged. But I really do want something that is central to all three empires and that is hard to take, but (sort of) easy to hold and is a great boon to the player holding it.

Double edit: Just want to be sure before I download this....GIMP 2.6.11 is the latest version? And the version for windows which says it's for XP SP2 or later is the correct one? I'm running Windows 7...so wanna be sure it'll work before downloading this beast...thanks!

[natty dread]

Well, since this is a fictional place, you can mess around with the lands as much as you want, and look at it purely from the perspective of making a good looking map with good gameplay.

If you merge 5,6,9 you can still isolate 9 from the others by using impassables.

Then you can move 8 a bit closer to 7, and move all of the 10-13 west.

[tkr4lf]

Sorry for taking so damn long at working on this thing. I've had other things on my mind. I redid the map, with an eye toward consolidating some of the land area and making it all fit with a legend in the correct size. So, here is what I have. I haven't got GIMP yet, and I'll probably wait until that tutorial you mentioned in a different thread is done before I mess with it too much. So, it's still done with paint for now. Any thoughts on it?

For clarification, the reddish regions are all one empire, the yellowish regions are all one empire, and the orangish/tannish regions are all one empire. I kept the gray central island and added in another small island group.



On further reflection, it may be best for me to seek someone who may be willing to assist me with the graphics. As is evident, I absolutely suck with a mouse. I simply don't have the hand control to draw correctly using a mouse. This honestly looks like the work of an 8 year old. haha

[natty dread]

The 2 first parts of my tutorial are out, you might want to check them out here: http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 6&t=140723

[tkr4lf]

The 2 first parts of my tutorial are out, you might want to check them out here: http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 6&t=140723

Thanks for making that tutorial, Natty. Without that, I would be completely lost on how to use gimp. I posted some problems I'm having in the thread you linked to, but should I just go ahead and post what I have here? It's basically everything before the gradient overlay step.

[natty dread]

I posted on the tutorial thread, your problem was a simple one... you forgot to read some text. You might also want to look at the 2nd part of the tutorial (Part 2a) which is on the same forum, it tells you how to create territory borders and such.

[tkr4lf]

Ok...well, I'm not finished with a final draft yet, but I figured I'd post what I have so you guys can see where I'm at and give any thoughts/comments.




There is still much to be done here. But I do have some general questions before I move forward.

How do you guys feel about the territ naming?
Does it seem like there are too many territories?
How do you like the structure of the map?
Is everything too close? Looking kind of squished in there?
Or is it ok like that?

I guess that's all I can think of right now. Any suggestions, comments, criticisms...etc. are welcomed and greatly appreciated.

[kengyin]

1. given that it is fictional, it is an organised way of naming, you might come up with new names later, but for now its ok
2. no, its good
3. i think its alright though i suggest you make the red section less boxy and uniform, i like the yellow region type of structure the best
4. is this supersize? i would suggest applying for supersize

[tkr4lf]

1. given that it is fictional, it is an organised way of naming, you might come up with new names later, but for now its ok
2. no, its good
3. i think its alright though i suggest you make the red section less boxy and uniform, i like the yellow region type of structure the best
4. is this supersize? i would suggest applying for supersize

Thanks for the feedback!

As far as supersize...no, I hadn't planned on it. The actualy picture on my PC is the correct dimensions...for some reason, it looks bigger here than it should. But supersize would help a lot. As of now many of the territs are too small and even fitting a name in there was a challenge. Trying to fit in the number circles (i'm not sure what they're called) will be pretty hard, and trying to fit in some sort of symbol for a city will be even harder. Plus I'm not sure if there is enough room in the legend to include everything that needs to be included.

I guess I'll have to think about this and possibly try applying for supersize. Although I remember reading somewhere that in order to get approval for it you have to be adding something, or there needs to be a good reason for it, other than just "I want a big map." But I'm not sure on this, so I'll just wait until someone more knowledgable about these things comes along.

And I'll see what I can do with the red areas.

Again, thanks for the feedback! Keep it coming!

[natty dread]

Thing is, you will also have to make a small version of the map... I think you should cut down the amount of territories. You don't have any small & easy bonus areas on the map, which could be used in the beginning of the game...

[kengyin]

i reckon some mountain ranges in the middle of red would be a good touch

[Riskismy]

aw. I think you removed the very first map you posted? Amazing how much this map evolved!

Making all the territories about the size of those on the lower yellow continent might solve your issues with making stuff fit.

[tkr4lf]

Thing is, you will also have to make a small version of the map... I think you should cut down the amount of territories. You don't have any small & easy bonus areas on the map, which could be used in the beginning of the game...

Yeah, I still need to make the small version. That's what I was wondering...if I should go for less territs that are bigger. I guess I should. As for smaller bonuses...do you think using impassables to make a few of the bonus regions defensible from maybe 2 points would work? Or should I go back in and redraw the borders to make a few of them only have maybe 6 or 7 territs each?

i reckon some mountain ranges in the middle of red would be a good touch

Yeah, I plan on doing some mountains, rivers and forrests to use as impassables. I just haven't gotten there yet.

aw. I think you removed the very first map you posted? Amazing how much this map evolved!

Making all the territories about the size of those on the lower yellow continent might solve your issues with making stuff fit.

Nah, the first map I posted is still on the first post of the thread. Going back and looking at it, that has to be the ugliest damn map I've ever seen lol.
As for the territ sizes...you're probably right.

The only thing is I kinda liked having so many territs. As of now, there are 164 territs, with 34 of them that will start neutral always. I plan on having two cities per bonus area which will start neutral, and the 3 island chains and the middle grey bonus would all start neutral. I guess I will have to play with this and see if I can't get a good number of territs while still making them all big enough to fit in army circles and cities where appropriate.




But ok, thanks for the input guys. I guess I'm off to do some more work on this beast.

Edit: And I just realized that I named two of the red bonus regions the exact same thing....great lol. One more thing to do.

[Riskismy]

Nah, the first map I posted is still on the first post of the thread. Going back and looking at it, that has to be the ugliest damn map I've ever seen lol.

hehe. It really is ugly
That's what makes this one above so great!

[natty dread]

To be honest, I think you could pretty much cut the amount of territories in each bonus area in half. The bonus areas look puffed up, like they're crammed full of territories just for the sake of having lots of territories.

Now if you purposefully want to make a large map out of this, one that has lots of territories... then you're going to have to reconsider the design of the map, divide it up more... But I think it would do better as a medium-sized map, by cutting the amount of territories.

[tkr4lf]

To be honest, I think you could pretty much cut the amount of territories in each bonus area in half. The bonus areas look puffed up, like they're crammed full of territories just for the sake of having lots of territories.

Now if you purposefully want to make a large map out of this, one that has lots of territories... then you're going to have to reconsider the design of the map, divide it up more... But I think it would do better as a medium-sized map, by cutting the amount of territories.

Ok.

I'll go back in and do some work on it and post back here when I'm done. I'll try to get rid of some territs and make them all bigger. It may be tomorrow or the next day, as I've got some stuff to do IRL (gah...stupid real life getting in the way). But I'll try to get it done as soon as I can. After I've got the territs worked out, then I'll go in and try out some impassables. I don't really want to make those if the territs aren't right, as I'll just have to do it over again.

One consideration though, if I were to cut each bonus region in half territ wise, then there really won't be enough to incude two cities in each bonus region. My plan was to have the cities be in territs that can't be attacked from another bonus region, only from a territ in the same bonus region. Does that make sense? I don't know, I could rework the idea if need be.

[tkr4lf]

Nah, the first map I posted is still on the first post of the thread. Going back and looking at it, that has to be the ugliest damn map I've ever seen lol.

hehe. It really is ugly
That's what makes this one above so great!

Thanks man!

[tkr4lf]

Ok...this is the version with fewer territs that are larger. Let me know what you think.

Honestly, I'm not that happy with it. I liked the other one a lot better. But I guess if you guys think it needs less territs that are bigger...

[natty dread]

No, that's a lot better, gameplay-wise and graphically.

Now you should start thinking about the theme and how to implement it into the gameplay. Currently, all you have are the territories... and some bonus areas. But you also have a story for this map, and a plain, standard gameplay doesn't necessarily reflect the story the best...

[tkr4lf]

One idea I had for the bonuses.....have the standard, colored bonuses. But then on top of that have a stacking bonus for the cities. I mean taking over the cities should be a big deal, so maybe something like +1 or +2 autodeploy on each city, and a bonus for holding so many cities. Say +1 for 1 city, +2 for 2 cities, etc. Having 2 cities per standard bonus region would make it rather easy to rack up a decent bonus just from holding the cities, which would make it much easier to take one of the standard bonus areas.

I pretty much disbanded the capital idea. I'm thinking just cities, and the Palace, on the middle gray island. I like the idea of a winning objective of holding the palace and a certain percent of the cities, say 25 out of 30 of the cities. Or maybe all of the cities, though that may be a bit hard.

Thoughts so far?

[rdsrds2120]

One idea I had for the bonuses.....have the standard, colored bonuses. But then on top of that have a stacking bonus for the cities. I mean taking over the cities should be a big deal, so maybe something like +1 or +2 autodeploy on each city, and a bonus for holding so many cities. Say +1 for 1 city, +2 for 2 cities, etc. Having 2 cities per standard bonus region would make it rather easy to rack up a decent bonus just from holding the cities, which would make it much easier to take one of the standard bonus areas.

I pretty much disbanded the capital idea. I'm thinking just cities, and the Palace, on the middle gray island. I like the idea of a winning objective of holding the palace and a certain percent of the cities, say 25 out of 30 of the cities. Or maybe all of the cities, though that may be a bit hard.

Thoughts so far?

I would have to know where the cities would be placed and what value neutral they'd start at before making those kind of judgement calls

Otherwise, this version looks much much much better.

-rd

[tkr4lf]

One idea I had for the bonuses.....have the standard, colored bonuses. But then on top of that have a stacking bonus for the cities. I mean taking over the cities should be a big deal, so maybe something like +1 or +2 autodeploy on each city, and a bonus for holding so many cities. Say +1 for 1 city, +2 for 2 cities, etc. Having 2 cities per standard bonus region would make it rather easy to rack up a decent bonus just from holding the cities, which would make it much easier to take one of the standard bonus areas.

I pretty much disbanded the capital idea. I'm thinking just cities, and the Palace, on the middle gray island. I like the idea of a winning objective of holding the palace and a certain percent of the cities, say 25 out of 30 of the cities. Or maybe all of the cities, though that may be a bit hard.

Thoughts so far?

I would have to know where the cities would be placed and what value neutral they'd start at before making those kind of judgement calls

Otherwise, this version looks much much much better.

-rd

Thank you!

As for where they will be, I'm not quite there yet. I still need to do impassables and such, and then I can figure out exactly where to put each city. As it is, I want to have two cities per bonus region, but I want them to not be able to be attacked from another bonus region. Does that make sense? Basically I don't want to put a city in one of the territs that is used to defend the bonus region. So as of now, there are only a few places that I could put them. But, with some impassables placed around, my options would open up a lot more.

And as for neutral value, I'm thinking since they have the potential to be such a powerful bonus, maybe a neutral 5 would suffice? Not sure about that one. Any input or suggestions would be welcome.