[Rules/MED] Cheaters should be stripped of medals [Rejected]

[deathcomesrippin]

I like the idea of stripping medals, I like the clarification. I think for the offences like multis it should be as people say, point reset and stripped of premium. I do think they should be allowed to buy back in once (as it is now) if they like. Good players will get the points back from 1k anyhow, and I think that medals should be stripped to the point of the earliest multi created. This would then give them the "honest" medals and not totally discount everything they might have earned through regular play. A quick search of the dates joined by the multis and the medals earned dates would allow you to figure it out rather quick. Also, if a medal is earned in a tourney that your multi is not a part of, I think you should be able to keep it. That's just me though.

[agentcom]

If the choice (for ease of administration) was between stripped of all relevant medals or they status quo, I would vote for stripped of all medals and a point reset.

Don't let these guys buy back to their old level. As has been noted, this is far too light of a punishment. I would definitely support this for all multi accounts. There is no legitimate reason to have multis: Either you're gaming the system to gain points or you're playing games you want to without risking your points. For this, you should get a full point reset and stripped of all game medals.

The question will be harder with farming/ranching cases, especially as rules develop. Does someone who falls afoul of the "unwritten rules" of abuse of the system deserve to be stripped of their medals? Your answer to this will correlate to what you think is farming and how big of a problem it is.

For flaming/baiting/bigotry, etc. abuse, maybe strip them of the less important but related medals of Ratings and General Contributions or Achievements. That's an appropriately mild punishment, I think.

For Freestyle turn abuse, maybe no points reset (or maybe still have that), but stripped of freestyle and team medals only. I don't know about the other settings.

Just some thoughts I have. Oh, I'll put one more out there. I don't like adding much discretion to the C&A mods ruling abilities (causes too much confusion/animosity already), but there is a case to be made for allowing this as an instrument of discretionary punishment. Perhaps the true farmer, who is sending PMs to ?s and schooling them gets the point reset, ban/buyback option AND the medal stripping; whereas, someone who just set up a high percentage of games that happen to be joined by ?s gets some combination, but not all, of the above.

[cookie0117]

If the choice (for ease of administration) was between stripped of all relevant medals or they status quo, I would vote for stripped of all medals and a point reset.

Don't let these guys buy back to their old level. As has been noted, this is far too light of a punishment. I would definitely support this for all multi accounts. There is no legitimate reason to have multis: Either you're gaming the system to gain points or you're playing games you want to without risking your points. For this, you should get a full point reset and stripped of all game medals.

The question will be harder with farming/ranching cases, especially as rules develop. Does someone who falls afoul of the "unwritten rules" of abuse of the system deserve to be stripped of their medals? Your answer to this will correlate to what you think is farming and how big of a problem it is.

For flaming/baiting/bigotry, etc. abuse, maybe strip them of the less important but related medals of Ratings and General Contributions or Achievements. That's an appropriately mild punishment, I think.

For Freestyle turn abuse, maybe no points reset (or maybe still have that), but stripped of freestyle and team medals only. I don't know about the other settings.

Just some thoughts I have. Oh, I'll put one more out there. I don't like adding much discretion to the C&A mods ruling abilities (causes too much confusion/animosity already), but there is a case to be made for allowing this as an instrument of discretionary punishment. Perhaps the true farmer, who is sending PMs to ?s and schooling them gets the point reset, ban/buyback option AND the medal stripping; whereas, someone who just set up a high percentage of games that happen to be joined by ?s gets some combination, but not all, of the above.

Any farmer/rancher is going to be noted before any punishment. If you have had your actions noted and you continue you are basically putting a finger up to the C and A process and are clearly doing something you should not. Then you get the punishment and it should take what you were so keen to take from others. No cheater of any description should be able to keep what they have stolen.

[betiko]

this is stupid. why bother with all these rules?

1 busted = 1 second chance; 2 busted out for ever.
3 warnings = 1 busted.

keep the system how it is; people get 2 chances and if they blow their second chance they are kicked out forever anyway.

[Symmetry]

I like the idea of stripping medals, I like the clarification. I think for the offences like multis it should be as people say, point reset and stripped of premium. I do think they should be allowed to buy back in once (as it is now) if they like. Good players will get the points back from 1k anyhow, and I think that medals should be stripped to the point of the earliest multi created. This would then give them the "honest" medals and not totally discount everything they might have earned through regular play. A quick search of the dates joined by the multis and the medals earned dates would allow you to figure it out rather quick. Also, if a medal is earned in a tourney that your multi is not a part of, I think you should be able to keep it. That's just me though.

That seems fair and presumably implementable. A decent compromise- keep what they earned fairly, let them earn the others back again on fair terms if they can.

[betiko]

I like the idea of stripping medals, I like the clarification. I think for the offences like multis it should be as people say, point reset and stripped of premium. I do think they should be allowed to buy back in once (as it is now) if they like. Good players will get the points back from 1k anyhow, and I think that medals should be stripped to the point of the earliest multi created. This would then give them the "honest" medals and not totally discount everything they might have earned through regular play. A quick search of the dates joined by the multis and the medals earned dates would allow you to figure it out rather quick. Also, if a medal is earned in a tourney that your multi is not a part of, I think you should be able to keep it. That's just me though.

That seems fair and presumably implementable. A decent compromise- keep what they earned fairly, let them earn the others back again on fair terms if they can.

so if someone got fairly to 380 unique kills and gets the last 20 with a multi account or whatever other cheating method, he gets removed all his kills and goes back to 100, meaning 280 honest kills to redo completely, and if he got to 120 not cheating and the last 280 cheating, basically he just loses 20 fair kills and the person has been cheating 14 times more.
also, this would be a hell of a pain in the ass for the poor mods to have to look for all these details. the idea is just dumb. you get banned forever anyway if you are caught cheating twice. a point reset is way easier for mods after a first busted case imho, they already have to deal with enough stuff.

why don't you play this game symetry instead of suggesting stuff for something you show no interest in?

[Symmetry]

I like the idea of stripping medals, I like the clarification. I think for the offences like multis it should be as people say, point reset and stripped of premium. I do think they should be allowed to buy back in once (as it is now) if they like. Good players will get the points back from 1k anyhow, and I think that medals should be stripped to the point of the earliest multi created. This would then give them the "honest" medals and not totally discount everything they might have earned through regular play. A quick search of the dates joined by the multis and the medals earned dates would allow you to figure it out rather quick. Also, if a medal is earned in a tourney that your multi is not a part of, I think you should be able to keep it. That's just me though.

That seems fair and presumably implementable. A decent compromise- keep what they earned fairly, let them earn the others back again on fair terms if they can.

so if someone got fairly to 380 unique kills

Sorry, I stopped at the part that marked you out as batshit insane. "Unique kills?", seriously?

How's the woman suit coming along? I've heard putting lotion on its skin helps.

[Symmetry]

So ignoring Buffalo-Betiko, and getting back to sane discussion....

I like the idea of stripping medals, I like the clarification. I think for the offences like multis it should be as people say, point reset and stripped of premium. I do think they should be allowed to buy back in once (as it is now) if they like. Good players will get the points back from 1k anyhow, and I think that medals should be stripped to the point of the earliest multi created. This would then give them the "honest" medals and not totally discount everything they might have earned through regular play. A quick search of the dates joined by the multis and the medals earned dates would allow you to figure it out rather quick. Also, if a medal is earned in a tourney that your multi is not a part of, I think you should be able to keep it. That's just me though.

That seems fair and presumably implementable. A decent compromise- keep what they earned fairly, let them earn the others back again on fair terms if they can.

[agentcom]

I like the idea of stripping medals, I like the clarification. I think for the offences like multis it should be as people say, point reset and stripped of premium. I do think they should be allowed to buy back in once (as it is now) if they like. Good players will get the points back from 1k anyhow, and I think that medals should be stripped to the point of the earliest multi created. This would then give them the "honest" medals and not totally discount everything they might have earned through regular play. A quick search of the dates joined by the multis and the medals earned dates would allow you to figure it out rather quick. Also, if a medal is earned in a tourney that your multi is not a part of, I think you should be able to keep it. That's just me though.

That seems fair and presumably implementable. A decent compromise- keep what they earned fairly, let them earn the others back again on fair terms if they can.

so if someone got fairly to 380 unique kills

Sorry, I stopped at the part that marked you out as batshit insane. "Unique kills?", seriously?

How's the woman suit coming along? I've heard putting lotion on its skin helps.

Umm ... they're called "unique kills." That's what medals are awarded for. It's not something he made up.

[deathcomesrippin]

This suggestion should be implemented.

[Symmetry]

Umm ... they're called "unique kills." That's what medals are awarded for. It's not something he made up.

You are incorrect.

Medals page

[Symmetry]

This suggestion should be implemented.

I hope it does, although in what way and to what extent it should be implemented are certainly debatable, I think the core suggestion is pretty solid.

[betiko]

Umm ... they're called "unique kills." That's what medals are awarded for. It's not something he made up.

You are incorrect.

Medals page

dude, you don't play the game stop talking about something you don't know
although it's quite funny to see you put so many effort into it, like all your discussions in off topics. I think your next cause could be about supporting more efficient vaginal herpes creams, or anything like that that is sooooo much of your concern.

[agentcom]

Umm ... they're called "unique kills." That's what medals are awarded for. It's not something he made up.

You are incorrect.

Medals page

Sorry ... "defeats of unique opponents" OR as many of us that play would call it "unique kills."

What's your problem man? You're highjacking your own thread.

[Symmetry]

Umm ... they're called "unique kills." That's what medals are awarded for. It's not something he made up.

You are incorrect.

Medals page

Sorry ... "defeats of unique opponents" OR as many of us that play would call it "unique kills."

What's your problem man? You're highjacking your own thread.

Pointing out why an objection is wrong ain't highjacking. Do you have further unreasonable objections, or can we discuss the topic without you getting upset when you are proven wrong?

[Pedronicus]

good idea.

[betiko]

Umm ... they're called "unique kills." That's what medals are awarded for. It's not something he made up.

You are incorrect.

Medals page

Sorry ... "defeats of unique opponents" OR as many of us that play would call it "unique kills."

What's your problem man? You're highjacking your own thread.

Pointing out why an objection is wrong ain't highjacking. Do you have further unreasonable objections, or can we discuss the topic without you getting upset when you are proven wrong?

agentcom, I think you understand better who you are dealing with... he probably never heard of maprank, but he knows more than any of us. Just look at his wall and comments left on it, he likes pissing people off, that's the only reason he comes on the site.

[agentcom]

Umm ... they're called "unique kills." That's what medals are awarded for. It's not something he made up.

You are incorrect.

Medals page

Sorry ... "defeats of unique opponents" OR as many of us that play would call it "unique kills."

What's your problem man? You're highjacking your own thread.

Pointing out why an objection is wrong ain't highjacking. Do you have further unreasonable objections, or can we discuss the topic without you getting upset when you are proven wrong?

Dammit Symmetry. I wasn't even making an objection. Unlike you, I've done nothing but contribute ideas to your damn suggestion and now I'm the one who has to keep you from derailing your own suggestion? I think you have me confused with betiko who had a problem with your suggestion. Instead of addressing his objection (which was reasonable even if you don't agree with it), you decided to attack his word choice of "unique kills." But "unique kills" are what players on this site call them. "Unique kills", "unique victories", "defeats of unique opponents": all these things mean the same thing. One of them has the advantage of being shorter. But you can't be bothered by that. You saw someone disagree with you and decided that it was easier to attack his word choice than his argument. And it wasn't even that hard of an argument to address. All you had to say was something like: "I believe multis are a serious problem on this site. I feel that this conduct is not justifiable. It is cheating. As such, it doesn't matter whether you got 1 of your defeats through farming or all of them. In trying to stop multis, we are going to subject all multis to the punishment of medal stripping and a point reset." Or maybe you disagree with that, but you could have put in your own thoughts (though I have a feeling that your feelings are pretty close to the quoted text).

But if you want to start fights with the people who are supporting or at least contributing to your suggestion, then let's see how far this goes. I'll help you get your own thread locked.

Now quit being a jackass and go lay down.

[Symmetry]

Umm ... they're called "unique kills." That's what medals are awarded for. It's not something he made up.

You are incorrect.

Medals page

Sorry ... "defeats of unique opponents" OR as many of us that play would call it "unique kills."

What's your problem man? You're highjacking your own thread.

Pointing out why an objection is wrong ain't highjacking. Do you have further unreasonable objections, or can we discuss the topic without you getting upset when you are proven wrong?

Dammit Symmetry. I wasn't even making an objection. Unlike you, I've done nothing but contribute ideas to your damn suggestion and now I'm the one who has to keep you from derailing your own suggestion? I think you have me confused with betiko who had a problem with your suggestion. Instead of addressing his objection (which was reasonable even if you don't agree with it), you decided to attack his word choice of "unique kills." But "unique kills" are what players on this site call them. "Unique kills", "unique victories", "defeats of unique opponents": all these things mean the same thing. One of them has the advantage of being shorter. But you can't be bothered by that. You saw someone disagree with you and decided that it was easier to attack his word choice than his argument. And it wasn't even that hard of an argument to address. All you had to say was something like: "I believe multis are a serious problem on this site. I feel that this conduct is not justifiable. It is cheating. As such, it doesn't matter whether you got 1 of your defeats through farming or all of them. In trying to stop multis, we are going to subject all multis to the punishment of medal stripping and a point reset." Or maybe you disagree with that, but you could have put in your own thoughts (though I have a feeling that your feelings are pretty close to the quoted text).

But if you want to start fights with the people who are supporting or at least contributing to your suggestion, then let's see how far this goes. I'll help you get your own thread locked.

Now quit being a jackass and go lay down.

i pointed out that you were wrong. I gave you a source for how you were wrong. I get this as a response. My personal take- you have difficulty accepting when you're wrong, to the point where it angers you. When and where I choose to pick a fight with you, you'll know. In this case, however, you're looking at me correcting your mistake and having difficulty accepting it.

You would have done better if you'd have typed "I fucked up, sorry Sym", but that would have meant that you couldn't blame me or make excuses.

[TheForgivenOne]

I am going to lock this for 24 hours to let everyone cool down. Symmetry, they are correct. "Defeating X unique opponents" is the same as Unique kills.

If the heated discussions don't cool down, I will lock it for a longer amount of time. And don't start up a new thread, I will only lock it.

[TheForgivenOne]

Alright, I am unlocking the thread. Keep the discussions civil.

[Symmetry]

Alright, I am unlocking the thread. Keep the discussions civil.

Civilly speaking, why didn't you reply to my PM?

[agentcom]

Alright, I am unlocking the thread. Keep the discussions civil.

Civilly speaking, why didn't you reply to my PM?

Haha, I almost sent him a PM, too. But I'm sure mine would have been quite different from yours.

Symmetry, I hope you can realize that I was initially offering tentative support for your idea. Don't believe me? Go back and read my posts. I just had a problem with you trying to shut down detractors by attacking their language rather than their arguments. Capiche?

If you continue to use such methods, I will continue to address them as I did before. If you, as I, would rather take a logical and reasoned approach to this suggestion, then I will to.

That's all I'll say for now.

[Master Kai]

There is some merit to the idea. Working out how it would work is another. Personally, if someone has the opportunity to just buy back into the game [I don't know if this is true], then maybe removing medals as well, may be enough of a deterrent for some folks. If people don't violate the rules, then they don't have to worry about how the sentence is applied.

Just my thoughts. But thanks for the suggestion. Certainly an idea worth exploring.

[lethlethe]

+1 for implemeting (some version) of this.