Re: WWI: Gallipoli [9.9.15] V39 (p22) [Quenched]

[cairnswk]

Sweet to see this one coming back.

Thanks Bruceswar. It's been a long time in development!

I am wondering if gameplay is finalised on this? Perhaps ian canton could comment.

[iancanton]

can the m1 and m2 mines attack the three minesweeper positions?
ian.

m1 and m2 are killer neutrals, but if you hold them, yes you can attack along the routes indicated.
I have deliberately made a selective path from the the orange blue and silver start positions here, so that there is some strategy between these guys, but if they decide to wipe each other out, they'd be crazy to let it happen on the 1st turn.

it's a standard tactic in trips and quads to wipe out an opponent from an area before he can play a turn, which is why i raised the question. does ms2 going to ms4 and ms5 instead of to m1 and m2 work any better?

ian.

[cairnswk]

can the m1 and m2 mines attack the three minesweeper positions?
ian.

m1 and m2 are killer neutrals, but if you hold them, yes you can attack along the routes indicated.
I have deliberately made a selective path from the the orange blue and silver start positions here, so that there is some strategy between these guys, but if they decide to wipe each other out, they'd be crazy to let it happen on the 1st turn.

it's a standard tactic in trips and quads to wipe out an opponent from an area before he can play a turn, which is why i raised the question. does ms2 going to ms4 and ms5 instead of to m1 and m2 work any better?

ian.

ian, sorry i didn't answer this without much thought previously.
i don't think MS2 going to MS4 and MS5 would work any better, and if done that way, would create advantage for MS2 by not having to conquer killer M1 or M2.
What perhaps will work better is if those routes have one-way arrows on them, all the way through to land, so that no-one can turn back and conquer a player behind them.
They will still have to run the gaunlet of someone capturing a fort on either side of the Dardenalles/Narrows though.

Version 33 with those changes

[iancanton]

the new one-way minesweeper layout works well.

there are a few regions, such as monash gully and quinn's post, which can be bombarded but have no special property other than the +1 auto-deploy and are not really on the way to anywhere. these are destined to remain neutral in most games, unless u reduce the neutrals to n2.

i think we're at the stage where we can freeze the layout (freeing u to work on graphics) and the only gameplay changes to consider, if any, will be neutrals and bonuses.

ian.

[cairnswk]

the new one-way minesweeper layout works well.
there are a few regions, such as monash gully and quinn's post, which can be bombarded but have no special property other than the +1 auto-deploy and are not really on the way to anywhere. these are destined to remain neutral in most games, unless u reduce the neutrals to n2.

OK, thanks ian. do you have in mind which terts you want reduced apart from monahs gully and quinn's post?

i think we're at the stage where we can freeze the layout (freeing u to work on graphics) and the only gameplay changes to consider, if any, will be neutrals and bonuses.
ian.

can we get the gameplay finalised as much as possible before i tend to more graphics?

[iancanton]

do you have in mind which terts you want reduced apart from monahs gully and quinn's post?

the land regions which are are neither adjacent to a starting region nor are part of only 6 troops separating starting regions from each other, plus all seamines and neutral minesweepers.

monash gully: n3 to n2
quinn's post: n3 to n2
tepe: n3 to n2
anafarta sagir: n3 to n2
kum tepe: n3 to n2
tekke burnu trenches: n6 to n2
sedd el bahr: n3 to n2
ms4, ms5, ms6, ms7, ms8 and ms9: n3 to n1
m1 ,m2 and m3: k3 to k2

can all forts bombard all narrows and all dardanelles? can forts bombard mines?

ian.

[cairnswk]

do you have in mind which terts you want reduced apart from monahs gully and quinn's post?

the land regions which are are neither adjacent to a starting region nor are part of only 6 troops separating starting regions from each other, plus all seamines and neutral minesweepers.

monash gully: n3 to n2
quinn's post: n3 to n2
tepe: n3 to n2
anafarta sagir: n3 to n2
kum tepe: n3 to n2
tekke burnu trenches: n6 to n2
sedd el bahr: n3 to n2
ms4, ms5, ms6, ms7, ms8 and ms9: n3 to n1
m1 ,m2 and m3: k3 to k2

Thanks for those

can all forts bombard all narrows and all dardanelles? can forts bombard mines?
ian.

Mmmm. that is going to be hard one to fix.
no use cluttering the map with more lines as indications!
colours may not work for coourblind!
i may have to word it in the legend somehow.

[cairnswk]

OK, changed all the neutrals to suggested by ian, and notated the bombards for the forts.

ian, i think the fort neutrals are out of kilter now, should they be re-examined, some are 3 some are 6, but i think possibly they should be similar.

[ManBungalow]

I'm already looking forward to playing this.

Graphics comments:
looks awesome
the Kilid Baar Plateau <-> Fistkush border line goes over some mountains

[cairnswk]

I'm already looking forward to playing this.

Graphics comments:
looks awesome
the Kilid Baar Plateau <-> Fistkush border line goes over some mountains

Thanks MB. i'll keep that in mind for GFX

[iancanton]

do you have in mind which terts you want reduced apart from monahs gully and quinn's post?

the land regions which are are neither adjacent to a starting region...

tekke burnu trenches: n6 to n2
sedd el bahr: n3 to n2

actually, neither tekke burnu trenches nor sedd el bahr qualifies, so we'd better make them n3 instead of n2.

ian, i think the fort neutrals are out of kilter now, should they be re-examined, some are 3 some are 6, but i think possibly they should be similar.

this doesn't really pose difficulties. the only reason some forts start as n6 is because they are adjacent to 2 starting regions. the minesweepers have no bonus and they can do very little with their 6 troops initially, so they're not a prime target for the forts. conversely, all of the landing ships have a +2 auto-deploy bonus, but are sitting ducks, so the main action is likely to take place there instead.

ian.

[cairnswk]

do you have in mind which terts you want reduced apart from monahs gully and quinn's post?

the land regions which are are neither adjacent to a starting region...

tekke burnu trenches: n6 to n2
sedd el bahr: n3 to n2

actually, neither tekke burnu trenches nor sedd el bahr qualifies, so we'd better make them n3 instead of n2.

Done.

ian, i think the fort neutrals are out of kilter now, should they be re-examined, some are 3 some are 6, but i think possibly they should be similar.

this doesn't really pose difficulties. the only reason some forts start as n6 is because they are adjacent to 2 starting regions. the minesweepers have no bonus and they can do very little with their 6 troops initially, so they're not a prime target for the forts. conversely, all of the landing ships have a +2 auto-deploy bonus, but are sitting ducks, so the main action is likely to take place there instead.

ian.

OK.
Version 35 up later today.

[cairnswk]

Version 35.
I've adjusted some of the borders to lighten them on the dark side of the map, and increased the borders all round to 2 pixels....they may need toning down some more on the light side now.
ian's suggestions as above are done.
and moved the border on the Kilid Plateau mountains as requested by MB.

[iancanton]

onward and upward!



ian.

[cairnswk]

onward and upward!



ian.

Cheers ian, much appreciated at long last

[cairnswk]

OK, over the last 4 yrs, this has been through the mill over and over...with relation to gameplay and lots of adjustsments to graphics to ensure clear determination of what is what.

I don't want to add anything else to the maps re graphics, but am willing to clear up small things where players may not be able to determine clearly something.

So, what needs clearing up?

[Bruceswar]

you gotta do something with those mountains to make the pop out a bit more so people can see them on the map. They get lost in places like lone pine ridge.

[cairnswk]

you gotta do something with those mountains to make the pop out a bit more so people can see them on the map. They get lost in places like lone pine ridge.

Is there any other place this needs adjusting?

[cairnswk]

Version 36....adjustments made to mountains near Lone Pine Ridge and others
and the road moved from Coreldraw to Fireworks so it is more part of the background drawing

[Seamus76]

Looks great cairns.

I believe Seamines is two words, Sea Mines.

Sorry if the Villages were explained earlier, but I want to make sure I understand them. So if I hold Krithia, that borders Madios? And all of the Villages just attack each other? Which I think is what it means.

[cairnswk]

Looks great cairns.

I believe Seamines is two words, Sea Mines.

Sorry if the Villages were explained earlier, but I want to make sure I understand them. So if I hold Krithia, that borders Madios? And all of the Villages just attack each other? Which I think is what it means.

Sea Mines is two words...correct....will fix.

Villages....border the next village via the roads
If you hold Krithia, you can attack Sedd el Bahr or Madios, but not Bigali
you then have to attain Madios to be able to attack Bigali...

[RedBaron0]

Since you don't have -land-mines I think the use of the word "sea" is redundant. "Mines" should be more than sufficient.

The beach color and their label are the same, and a few are too close together to the point where the labels disappear into the beaches themselves. KK Beach being the biggest offender I can see where half the "B" disappears into he beach. A dark glow or outline should fix this.

[cairnswk]

Since you don't have -land-mines I think the use of the word "sea" is redundant. "Mines" should be more than sufficient.

The beach color and their label are the same, and a few are too close together to the point where the labels disappear into the beaches themselves. KK Beach being the biggest offender I can see where half the "B" disappears into he beach. A dark glow or outline should fix this.

A dark glow or outline on what...the text or the beach colour...??

[RedBaron0]

Text probably. Though you could try a darker yellow inner glow on the beaches and see which you like better.

[cairnswk]

Version 36 adjusted...i've changed the colour of the beaches slightly and moved the main offender KK Beach text south slightly so not to interfere with the beach again.