Shall we call it "doin the josko"?

[codeblue1018]

24 hours is 24 hours; what people are doing is completely within the rules so as long as no missed turns occur as a result to gain an advantage. What else can you do aside from eliminating the scoring system.

[Shannon Apple]

Fair play to him if he can keep it up because I highly doubt one can gain as many points as you're suggesting without holding people hostage. If he can do it and play all top notch players like Josko did, more power to him. Josko was sitting at 5400+ before he made his run to 6300+, so he only gained 900-1000 points. He paid for it though by losing a lot more than he earned due to the severe point losses he would have had then.

To be fair, I believe NoS is a general because of points gained during the FS BRs last month.

you even read what you write?

I can do this even easier then the rest, just start bunch of poly hives and fixed them to all drop on the same day playing every turn within 24h frame

I think the bolded part is more important for what you suggested, rather than the bit you plucked out. It would take a lot more than 900-1000 points for you to become conquerer/beat the all time high score. That was my point, which you missed. Get where I am coming from now? 1000 points isn't that hard to do legitimately, however 3000 might require abuse of the game such as hostage taking.

getting 1000 points from 5k to 6k is much harder then getting from 2k to 4,5k

If your average opponent's score is 2000, then it takes about 140 won games to go from 5000 to 6000. It takes about 200 to go from 2000 to 4500.

Not if average rank is higher than that. I would say average was over 2500 points since they were all majors and above.

Well, let's just say it's not something I'd be prepared to put my time and energy into doing. I don't care about points enough.

The only way to stop this is to require turns be taken in order of least time remaining to greatest. Then one would be prevented from accelerating winners and delaying losers, or the opposite of accelerating all losers to plummet the score & delay winners to shoot up on the backside.

I would say a big FAT no to this because of clan games. Sometimes you have to leave a turn until you discuss it, so that would prevent one from taking all the other turns after it while they wait.

[rhp 1]

A new points system would be good too. I'll let some mathematical genius work that one out.

Or how about people just play their turns. Or quit abusing loop holes sometimes you don't even want to look nor play a loosing game, but when you are doing in to only manipulate the score board then there, should be a issue.

lol.. sure.. that'll happen...

[rhp 1]

24 hours is 24 hours; what people are doing is completely within the rules so as long as no missed turns occur as a result to gain an advantage. What else can you do aside from eliminating the scoring system.

I'm not even sure if this is feasible? why can't one miss a turn? most times, other players would be happy for an opponent to miss a turn... if you're allowed to miss a turn, then it seems ludicrous to legislate against that, no?
interesting topic...

[Metsfanmax]

If your average opponent's score is 2000, then it takes about 140 won games to go from 5000 to 6000. It takes about 200 to go from 2000 to 4500.

Not if average rank is higher than that. I would say average was over 2500 points since they were all majors and above.

I was just giving a concrete example. If the average score was even 3000 points, it would take 135 games for 2000 -> 4500 but only 92 for 5000 -> 6000, so the conclusion still holds.

[rhp 1]

all of this statistical analysis is really interesting *rolls eyes*... point is, NoS is proving a point that any one of 100's (maybe 1000s) of players could have chosen to do.. the system (for people who care) is broken, or at least the scoreboard is more or less a joke when people (which they will do) exploit it. this is objectively true. personally I don't care.. I don't have the determination, patience, or the drive (all of which are needed) to reach conquerer legitimately. nor do I care to exploit the system to do so... on the flip side of this, I think, regardless of the means, it's a pain in the ass to reach the top... someone... I think Gary (DF) suggested some method of historical scoring to separate out the legit and not so legit conquerers... I'm not sure what this would look like, but it seems a good idea... Josko (who I assume is a really good player) is no Herpes... nor is he many other of the all time great Conqs (yeah, you too DF).... could he have been? maybe? I don't know... but his rise to the top, regardless of his skill, is tainted... don't know if he cares.. I don't (but it's sorta fun to talk about)...

[universalchiro]

The only way to stop this is to require turns be taken in order of least time remaining to greatest. Then one would be prevented from accelerating winners and delaying losers, or the opposite of accelerating all losers to plummet the score & delay winners to shoot up on the backside.

I would say a big FAT no to this because of clan games. Sometimes you have to leave a turn until you discuss it, so that would prevent one from taking all the other turns after it while they wait.

+1 Ya forgot about lots of discussion in chat for teams. My teammates are usually in states , so we get chat done pretty quick. But sometimes we have to stew on a turn and this takes time. So good point

[EBConquer]

I don't understand what all the fuss is about. Everybody has 24 hrs to take their turn. If there are no turns missed and no hostage taking then what the heck are we even talking about here. I don't know Josko but have had some interaction w/ him and he seems like a decent guy so what's w/ the charades?

Shit, am i in the wrong thread? lol

I don't think it matters how the point are structure is on this site, there will always be unhappy people. period. isn't that the way it works? as in life? half of us are poor and half are rich. some of us spend many hours on this site, the others, not so much. I think this is a fundamental part of human nature so let's just chill.

EDIT: fixed many typos

[universalchiro]

Probably should take josko out of thread title and stop saying negative things about a player that was found innocent. Let's keep this about an idea/discussion rather than about a player.

[ChrisPond]

52% turns taken? Maybe nos should try and get the attendance over 75%?

[jltile1]

The only way to stop this is to require turns be taken in order of least time remaining to greatest. Then one would be prevented from accelerating winners and delaying losers, or the opposite of accelerating all losers to plummet the score & delay winners to shoot up on the backside.

I would say a big FAT no to this because of clan games. Sometimes you have to leave a turn until you discuss it, so that would prevent one from taking all the other turns after it while they wait.

+1 Ya forgot about lots of discussion in chat for teams. My teammates are usually in states , so we get chat done pretty quick. But sometimes we have to stew on a turn and this takes time. So good point

It's pretty damn simple as this has been talked about before.
1. Don't use abuse of the game
2. Don't use a CROWN then throw a JOKE in and try to use your NOS to jump the score board.


Now if your good enough to get a high Score so be it. But when you are doing things to manipulate the score, this should not be tolerated. Period the end...

[ChrisPond]

I think it should be implemented for casual games where you cannot take a turn unless you have taken your true "next turn"

Only problem with this is when u have team games and u are looking for consensus in chat before going.

And I rarely take the "next turn" that is order. I sometimes play the easy turns first while my mind works out strategy on turns that require some thinking.

[rhp 1]

52% turns taken? Maybe nos should try and get the attendance over 75%?

Its obviously a glitch slapshot.

[NoSurvivors]

52% turns taken? Maybe nos should try and get the attendance over 75%?

Its obviously a glitch slapshot.

A glitch that unfortunately even the admins can't fix :/ so I have to deal with it.

anyhow since I've created more attention to the subject which as rhp said was my intent I won't continue. I just hope everyone gets that things need to change if we are gonna stop this nonsense...

[jltile1]

Probably should take josko out of thread title and stop saying negative things about a player that was found innocent. Let's keep this about an idea/discussion rather than about a player.

Ha ha Joke -O is not a free willy, that cums from my pants. How can you take is name out of the most obvious CC point controversy. What he did is why we are talking here, if you NO like NO talky here. Jokey and krunk juice and NOStradamus all believe that milking cows with more than normal nipples is rather fair. Some reason the cows are on their side of the fence. This will be my last post unless someone has something really good to say. And no I won't crack your back, JOKE with you or play with your fork! Time to spoon my self to sleep.

[NoSurvivors]

Probably should take josko out of thread title and stop saying negative things about a player that was found innocent. Let's keep this about an idea/discussion rather than about a player.

Ha ha Joke -O is not a free willy, that cums from my pants. How can you take is name out of the most obvious CC point controversy. What he did is why we are talking here, if you NO like NO talky here. Jokey and krunk juice and NOStradamus all believe that milking cows with more than normal nipples is rather fair. Some reason the cows are on their side of the fence. This will be my last post unless someone has something really good to say. And no I won't crack your back, JOKE with you or play with your fork! Time to spoon my self to sleep.

You know why I like you? Cos you have to be the most random person on this site. Lol

[D4 Damager]

The actual problem here is that no-one seems to give a rat's ass about setting up a legitimate high-score table against which all players can measure themselves (with the exception of demonfork, who was/is maintaining an unofficial record himself). Just look here at the overwhelming response to my suggestion.

The new players don't know enough to realise there are many different styles of play and ways to manipulate the system. They probably look at the King_Herpes or josko.ri high-scores as something they could achieve if only they were excellent sequential players too, not realising that much higher win-ratios are possible in freestyle or that you can stagger your wins and losses to inflate your score. The medium-term players are too invested in the status quo because they are the ones trying to get their personal best scores in the system as it is. The long-term players couldn't care less, they have had their time taking scores seriously and have given up any hope of a meaningful and comparitive conqueror title and all-time high-score. The CC guys probably realise that it would be a big commitment to create and maintain such a table, with high chance to annoy those happy with the way things are. So here we are and here we will probably stay.

To answer the thread title, no we should not call it that because it's unfair on a good player who certainly did not invent the technique. He would not have needed to do that to make his mark if there was a fair way to compare players high-scores from the past.

[sdh]

I don't understand what all the fuss is about. Everybody has 24 hrs to take their turn. If there are no turns missed and no hostage taking then what the heck are we even talking about here. I don't know Josko but have had some interaction w/ him and he seems like a decent guy so what's w/ the charades?

Shit, am i in the wrong thread? lol

I don't think it matters how the point are structure is on this site, there will always be unhappy people. period. isn't that the way it works? as in life? half of us are poor and half are rich. some of us spend many hours on this site, the others, not so much. I think this is a fundamental part of human nature so let's just chill.

EDIT: fixed many typos

Couldn't agree more. Don't see why people care.

[sdh]

I don't understand what all the fuss is about. Everybody has 24 hrs to take their turn. If there are no turns missed and no hostage taking then what the heck are we even talking about here. I don't know Josko but have had some interaction w/ him and he seems like a decent guy so what's w/ the charades?

Shit, am i in the wrong thread? lol

I don't think it matters how the point are structure is on this site, there will always be unhappy people. period. isn't that the way it works? as in life? half of us are poor and half are rich. some of us spend many hours on this site, the others, not so much. I think this is a fundamental part of human nature so let's just chill.

EDIT: fixed many typos

Couldn't agree more. Don't see why people care.

[D4 Damager]

Spoiler

I don't understand what all the fuss is about. Everybody has 24 hrs to take their turn. If there are no turns missed and no hostage taking then what the heck are we even talking about here. I don't know Josko but have had some interaction w/ him and he seems like a decent guy so what's w/ the charades?

Shit, am i in the wrong thread? lol

I don't think it matters how the point are structure is on this site, there will always be unhappy people. period. isn't that the way it works? as in life? half of us are poor and half are rich. some of us spend many hours on this site, the others, not so much. I think this is a fundamental part of human nature so let's just chill.

EDIT: fixed many typos

Couldn't agree more. Don't see why people care.

Called it

The long-term players couldn't care less, they have had their time taking scores seriously and have given up any hope of a meaningful and comparitive conqueror title and all-time high-score.

[Armandolas]

52% turns taken? Maybe nos should try and get the attendance over 75%?

Its obviously a glitch slapshot.

A glitch that unfortunately even the admins can't fix :/ so I have to deal with it.

anyhow since I've created more attention to the subject which as rhp said was my intent I won't continue. I just hope everyone gets that things need to change if we are gonna stop this nonsense...

Please continue...we need this to be outrageous , so u need to hold the conqueror. People just appear to be scandalized when someone reaches that medal.

[NoSurvivors]

52% turns taken? Maybe nos should try and get the attendance over 75%?

Its obviously a glitch slapshot.

A glitch that unfortunately even the admins can't fix :/ so I have to deal with it.

anyhow since I've created more attention to the subject which as rhp said was my intent I won't continue. I just hope everyone gets that things need to change if we are gonna stop this nonsense...

Please continue...we need this to be outrageous , so u need to hold the conqueror. People just appear to be scandalized when someone reaches that medal.

as the Internet meme goes "ain't nobody got time do dat". Plus I've already let my losses catch me. I really do wish I'd continued but I would rather enjoy the next few days of my life and not deal with random C and A threads which are inevitable.. Sorry to disappoint you guys

[MrPinky]

The actual problem here is that no-one seems to give a rat's ass about setting up a legitimate high-score table against which all players can measure themselves.

Well, we have never had...and will never have... a legitimate score-system in the first place.

There are so many different maps, and so many different settings, that the score will always try to compare oranges and apples no matter what we do. And no matter what rules we have, someone will try to find a map and a setting that will allow them to have a higher edge and go for a max score.

You hear it all the time "generals can not afford to play with lowrated players", "it is too expensive to play on a simple map, theres no edge". "speed games will kill your score" "I wish I could play more doodle games, but I can't"

The score is a product of many many variables, one of them is your ability to play. But there are so many others, ie what maps you play, what settings you like, which opponents you play against, whether or not you make a "crown" or a "josko", and also if you sometimes let IRL interfere and miss turns from time to time.

Maybe someone in the past could get 6000 score from playing mostly speed freestyle games .... but that does not necessarily make him the best player on the site.... Likewise, someone doing a "crown" is probably not the best player either. No matter who is in the top, they will have some preferences to maps, settings or how they spend their 24h, and the fact that they have a high score only proves that they are competent players and they are very good at their little "niche" games, and have shown some dedication...

Nothing more

[universalchiro]

The actual problem here is that no-one seems to give a rat's ass about setting up a legitimate high-score table against which all players can measure themselves.

Well, we have never had...and will never have... a legitimate score-system in the first place.

There are so many different maps, and so many different settings, that the score will always try to compare oranges and apples no matter what we do. And no matter what rules we have, someone will try to find a map and a setting that will allow them to have a higher edge and go for a max score.

You hear it all the time "generals can not afford to play with lowrated players", "it is too expensive to play on a simple map, theres no edge". "speed games will kill your score" "I wish I could play more doodle games, but I can't"

The score is a product of many many variables, one of them is your ability to play. But there are so many others, ie what maps you play, what settings you like, which opponents you play against, whether or not you make a "crown" or a "josko", and also if you sometimes let IRL interfere and miss turns from time to time.

Maybe someone in the past could get 6000 score from playing mostly speed freestyle games .... but that does not necessarily make him the best player on the site.... Likewise, someone doing a "crown" is probably not the best player either. No matter who is in the top, they will have some preferences to maps, settings or how they spend their 24h, and the fact that they have a high score only proves that they are competent players and they are very good at their little "niche" games, and have shown some dedication...

Nothing more

+1

Hey NoSurvivors, you did it backwards. The best way is to accelerate the losing games so your score plummets. And delay the winning games so your score shoots up and ends the experiment on a high note. Then repeat the process again but in reverse to get Conqueror.

[Foxglove]

A new points system would be good too. I'll let some mathematical genius work that one out.

Or how about people just play their turns. Or quit abusing loop holes sometimes you don't even want to look nor play a loosing game, but when you are doing in to only manipulate the score board then there, should be a issue.

I've never loosed a game in my life. I keep them all strictly constrained.