What does a border truce imply?

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Dougal McTavish
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What does a border truce imply?

Post by Dougal McTavish »

How do people generally interpret a border truce. After a misunderstanding I'm realising a bit more clarity is a good idea when setting up truces, but if there is no further specification, here's my opinion: if two players have one shared border (2 territories, between regions held for a bonus) then a border truce means they cannot attack between those territories. All other attacks are allowed. This includes one player busting the other's the bonus using another route. Any other thoughts?

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Donelladan
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by Donelladan »

You interpretation is generally correct. But it helps to be precise when you make the border truce, to avoid missunderstanding.
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betiko
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by betiko »

if you have such border truce and you go break the bonus of your "ally" from somewhre else, be sure he'll break the so called border truce.
and yes, when you make a truce be as specific as you can in terms of agreements, and always give an end condition to your truce.
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rockfist
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by rockfist »

I agree with everything above.
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owenshooter
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by owenshooter »

Dougal McTavish wrote:How do people generally interpret a border truce.
that you are not a very good player...-Jésus noir
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JBlombier
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by JBlombier »

Haha, Owen is saying (in his nicest wording) that truces aren't a good idea, ever. I tend to agree with that. There are a handful of games where I've been involved in a truce and in all of them I broke them, because I felt it hurt the game-mechanic.

You won't hear me say it's always bad. A truce can get you the victory, for sure. I believe we've had some (later 'convicted', but still) genius strategists who came close to Conqueror, using diplomacy as their primary weapon; truces being their biggest trademark. I forgot their names, but they played the Third Crusade map (someone please fill it in).

The way I see it, is not whether it's ethical or moral or strategic or whatever. The way I see it is that a truce is just another manmade form of the thousands of forms we use to end this game in a victorious way. I'll never blame anyone for using it or breaking it, because it's their form of strategy. However, I do think truces make you lazy (about the few involved territories, when you should actually read the entire map all the time) and make you interpret the map and game-mechanic in a wrong way, because of the truce.

I haven't got the feeling I'm making my point here at all, but let's assume I did. Don't make truces, just play the game. It's difficult enough as it is! And if it isn't, you're not playing the right games ;)

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waauw
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by waauw »

I like truces. I make them ALL THE TIME, in the 8-player standard games anyway.
There are honorable people when it comes to truces. I've lost games purely because I was still bound to a truce and had to wait out as the other player got too strong too fast.
I take them very seriously and I expect other players to take them seriously as well.
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JBlombier
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by JBlombier »

You expect them to take it seriously, but what if they don't act like you expected?
I would never sit a game out and lose, because I made a truce. I guess the moral theory is that the winner deserves it, partly because he made that truce. To me, truces are merely words and nothing more. If I have to write some other words in chat (ie. break the truce) to turn the game in my favor, I will always do it. This game is about winning in the first place, honorability is an aspect of the game you made up yourself. Perhaps a nice aspect, but a non-priority-aspect at all times for me.

Waauw, I guess you should be happy we usually team up, because I'd backstab you in a standard game any time 8-)

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owenshooter
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by owenshooter »

waauw wrote:I take them very seriously and I expect other players to take them seriously as well.
good luck with that... feel free to join any of my games at ANY time...-Jésus noir

waauw playing with his friends...
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by waauw »

owenshooter wrote:
waauw wrote:I take them very seriously and I expect other players to take them seriously as well.
good luck with that... feel free to join any of my games at ANY time...-Jésus noir
You've mentioned on the forums a multitude of times that you would backstab people, I would never accept any truce with you obviously ;)
I'm not stupid, I do check people's ratings before I make a truce.
JBlombier wrote:You expect them to take it seriously, but what if they don't act like you expected?
They will receive a 1/5 rating. Though backstabbing me isn't as simple as it seems, I usually set up some contingency plans(truce =/= blind faith). Like hiding secret stashes behind my lines in fog games, stacking borders high enough that any 1-turn drop would be insignificant enough or smashing so hard into one specific player that he'll only share a border with my truce-mate(especially good tactic on Conquer Rome). The latter is an especially nice trick as your partner will need you more than you need them and you can just wait for the right timing.

On top of that, I do get vindictive towards people who get on my bad side. Diplomacy isn't only a weapon of defense, it's also a good method to push a specific player into a corner. Players who backstab usually lose all credibility in chat, which can be advantageous.
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owenshooter
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by owenshooter »

waauw wrote:
owenshooter wrote:
waauw wrote:I take them very seriously and I expect other players to take them seriously as well.
good luck with that... feel free to join any of my games at ANY time...-Jésus noir
You've mentioned on the forums a multitude of times that you would backstab people, I would never accept any truce with you obviously ;)
I'm not stupid, I do check people's ratings before I make a truce.
but, that wouldn't help you... there is nothing in my multitude of ratings that implies i do such...-Jésus noir
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waauw
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by waauw »

owenshooter wrote:
waauw wrote:
owenshooter wrote:
waauw wrote:I take them very seriously and I expect other players to take them seriously as well.
good luck with that... feel free to join any of my games at ANY time...-Jésus noir
You've mentioned on the forums a multitude of times that you would backstab people, I would never accept any truce with you obviously ;)
I'm not stupid, I do check people's ratings before I make a truce.
but, that wouldn't help you... there is nothing in my multitude of ratings that implies i do such...-Jésus noir
With most people I check their ratings. You on the other hand, are a special case. Pretty much every forum regular knows what you think of truces.
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owenshooter
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by owenshooter »

waauw wrote:With most people I check their ratings. You on the other hand, are a special case. Pretty much every forum regular knows what you think of truces.
psst... and most people with any sense, also know i only play team or poly games...-Jésus noir
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nippersean
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by nippersean »

JBlombier wrote:
You won't hear me say it's always bad. A truce can get you the victory, for sure. I believe we've had some (later 'convicted', but still) genius strategists who came close to Conqueror, using diplomacy as their primary weapon; truces being their biggest trademark. I forgot their names, but they played the Third Crusade map (someone please fill it in).


- JBlombier
Kiron and xiangwang. I think they also used waterloo map earlier
Chariot of Fire
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Re: What does a border truce imply?

Post by Chariot of Fire »

I interpret it that when you make a promise you keep your word, simple as that. What's more important, 20 points or your reputation?

I'm in a game now where someone (no names) made a truce, broke it, and now treats it lightly as if it didn't matter or wasn't 'official enough'.

Anyone in this thread that has posted that he would preempt a truce by attacking his neighbor has no dignity, simple as that. Breaking a truce is fine if it's done with due notice. Not doing so is actually just cowardly the more I think of it.
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