Multi Mark

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 7:20 am

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<Subject>:

* Have any user found guilty of cheating (multi or otherwise) branded with a "multi mark" for a period of time after the guilty verdict.

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* Suggestion Idea: Indicate all cheaters by some verbage so other users are aware of their cheating ways.
* Specifics: Anywhere the users handle is shown, it would show [Cheater].
* Why it is needed: I think any account convicted of being a multi or otherwise cheating, should be flagged so people are aware that he has been convicted of a playing multis. I feel that multis, while they may have their multi accounts suspended, are not punished enough. They still get points from their games in progress, and the players they beat while cheating lose points. AND it's not fair for them to continue and play people who are unaware of their status as a cheater. And it's particularly frustrating when you KNOW you are playing 3 players who are in fact one player, and you cannot do anything about it.

* Priority** (1-5): 3

**Note**

1 = Bottom of 'To Do' list
5 = Urgent, implement with next update

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gimil · Post by **gimil** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 7:57 am

i completely agree i mod should freeze ALL points a cheater is due to gain.

(my fav example) if u use steroids in teh olympics thn u get striped of your medal. Same should apply here.

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 7:30 am

Interesting that this hasn't sparked more conversation. I find cheaters to be very irritating.

frood · Post by **frood** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 2:10 pm

If you get caught for being a multi you get banned so a mark would not do much.

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 5:11 pm

frood wrote:If you get caught for being a multi you get banned so a mark would not do much.

I was told that the multi accounts were suspended, but if you are a premie your primary account is not suspended. Is this not the case?

After a multi is found guilty, he's still allowed to continue and finish his games, along with the extra accounts he's using. Only the extra accounts are suspended after the games are completed (according to what I was told) .

Look up pelgrim. He was convicted of being a multi, played a game with me using 2 other accounts. He continues to play games, new ones. I guess his account hasn't been suspended.

I believe that every account branded as a multi, premium or not, should be branded so in any current games he's involved in, the other users are aware.

reverend_kyle · Post by **reverend_kyle** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 6:24 pm

I think this has actually been thrown around in the past and rejected.

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 10:04 pm

reverend_kyle wrote:I think this has actually been thrown around in the past and rejected.

Why was it rejected? It seems like it would certainly discourage cheaters.

john1099 · Post by **john1099** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 10:09 pm

why, because you are branded as one?
Get a premium and play more games, and worry less about who is a multi- or not

Or, if you have a premium, then play more games

I for one do not need to know who is a ex- multi or not, because they are warned if they create any more accounts, they will be banned (from my understanding), so that should discourage them enough!

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 9:50 am

john1099 wrote:why, because you are branded as one?
Get a premium and play more games, and worry less about who is a multi- or not
Or, if you have a premium, then play more games

Yeah, that's why I want multis marked, because I am one. Idiot.

Fact is, had you looked up my account, as I did yours, you would see I am a premium member. I have 32 games currently going. The issue isn't about games, or the # of them or whatever.

Remember John, this is a GAME. I want my GAMING experience to be FUN. Cheaters take the FUN out of the GAME.

john1099 wrote:I for one do not need to know who is a ex- multi or not, because they are warned if they create any more accounts, they will be banned (from my understanding), so that should discourage them enough!

Well, had you read my post above, you would see that's not the case. Apparently, the multi'ed accounts are suspended, but not the primary, esp. if it's a paid account. Hence the issue.

Please read before posting, it makes the conversation more beneficial to all concerned.

alex_white101 · Post by **alex_white101** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 9:56 am

robbart wrote:
john1099 wrote:why, because you are branded as one?
Get a premium and play more games, and worry less about who is a multi- or not
Or, if you have a premium, then play more games
Yeah, that's why I want multis marked, because I am one. Idiot.

Fact is, had you looked up my account, as I did yours, you would see I am a premium member. I have 32 games currently going. The issue isn't about games, or the # of them or whatever.

Remember John, this is a GAME. I want my GAMING experience to be FUN. Cheaters take the FUN out of the GAME.

john1099 wrote:I for one do not need to know who is a ex- multi or not, because they are warned if they create any more accounts, they will be banned (from my understanding), so that should discourage them enough!
Well, had you read my post above, you would see that's not the case. Apparently, the multi'ed accounts are suspended, but not the primary, esp. if it's a paid account. Hence the issue.

Please read before posting, it makes the conversation more beneficial to all concerned.

u read his post wrong. he did not accuse u of being a multi, he was saying it rhetorically which u clearly did not understand. and i agree with what he says. multies are allowed back if they buy premium. they then know if they get caught doing it again they are permanently kicked. y wud they spend 20$ and cheat again in the same way they were previously caught? dosent make sense. i dnt mind this idea but i dont think its really necessary nor moving the site in the correct direction.

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 9:57 am

alex_white101 wrote:
robbart wrote:
john1099 wrote:why, because you are branded as one?
Get a premium and play more games, and worry less about who is a multi- or not
Or, if you have a premium, then play more games
Yeah, that's why I want multis marked, because I am one. Idiot.

Fact is, had you looked up my account, as I did yours, you would see I am a premium member. I have 32 games currently going. The issue isn't about games, or the # of them or whatever.

Remember John, this is a GAME. I want my GAMING experience to be FUN. Cheaters take the FUN out of the GAME.

john1099 wrote:I for one do not need to know who is a ex- multi or not, because they are warned if they create any more accounts, they will be banned (from my understanding), so that should discourage them enough!
Well, had you read my post above, you would see that's not the case. Apparently, the multi'ed accounts are suspended, but not the primary, esp. if it's a paid account. Hence the issue.

Please read before posting, it makes the conversation more beneficial to all concerned.
u read his post wrong. he did not accuse u of being a multi, he was saying it rhetorically which u clearly did not understand. and i agree with what he says. multies are allowed back if they buy premium. they then know if they get caught doing it again they are permanently kicked. y wud they spend 20$ and cheat again in the same way they were previously caught? dosent make sense. i dnt mind this idea but i dont think its really necessary nor moving the site in the correct direction.

What's the "correct direction"?

I want to discourage cheating. Why is that a bad thing?

You know what is a good thing? Draw attention to it, and watch as the number of cheaters dwindles. I think that is a good direction.

alex_white101 · Post by **alex_white101** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 10:00 am

well i dont think it good for a new member to the site to have their attention drawn to the number of cheaters on the site, it may scare them off or think cheating is a big problem with the site...... that is a bad direction. also it wont stop people cheating, rather discourage them from buying premium to stay on the site as they will now be branded a cheat.

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 10:05 am

alex_white101 wrote:well i dont think it good for a new member to the site to have their attention drawn to the number of cheaters on the site, it may scare them off or think cheating is a big problem with the site...... that is a bad direction. also it wont stop people cheating, rather discourage them from buying premium to stay on the site as they will now be branded a cheat.

Well, I won't disagree with that . I feel the same way. But I believe it would discourage the practice, and less people would want to be branded as such.

Did you consider the fact that by identifying cheaters so openly, that you are acknowledging that cheating does happen, and that CC takes cheating seriously? That is a good thing. And it gives CC an air of credibility.

alex_white101 · Post by **alex_white101** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 10:08 am

i spose it would depend on the number of people who had these multi marks

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 10:10 am

alex_white101 wrote:i spose it would depend on the number of people who had these multi marks

True, and I think it would dwindle over time.

The other thing, is that it would demonstrate how CC is self policing. We actually look out for the integrity of the game. Again, an important decision on whether or not I want to fork out the $20.

AK_iceman · Post by **AK_iceman** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 11:05 am

lackattack wrote:We do let multis come back if they upgrade to Premium Membership, and if more than one of the banned accounts re-activates that way, the must have different billing information.

Once you have been busted as a multi, your account is flagged as such, and we take extra measures to ensure that you do not continue to have multiple accounts.

Most busted multis never come back, but some pay the fine, suffer a battered reputation, and in our experience, mostly stay clean.

QFT

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 12:29 pm

AK_iceman wrote:
lackattack wrote:We do let multis come back if they upgrade to Premium Membership, and if more than one of the banned accounts re-activates that way, the must have different billing information.

Once you have been busted as a multi, your account is flagged as such, and we take extra measures to ensure that you do not continue to have multiple accounts.

Most busted multis never come back, but some pay the fine, suffer a battered reputation, and in our experience, mostly stay clean.
QFT

AK, QFT?

Is this saying that flagging the account for all to see isn't worthwhile or useful, for the aforementioned reasons?

AK_iceman · Post by **AK_iceman** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 12:38 pm

Yeah, GFT = Quoted for truth. I don't think we need a multi mark for the reasons stated above. It doesn't really make sense to have it.

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 1:15 pm

AK_iceman wrote:Yeah, GFT = Quoted for truth. I don't think we need a multi mark for the reasons stated above. It doesn't really make sense to have it.

Ok, well if you guys don't see the need, then I defer.

However, my last pitch on this.

I am not sure how embarrassed the users get... if there's nothing showing everyone that they are a cheater. Short of someone going into any of the games the cheater is playing in and posting a message, the only way you find out is if someone reports them as a cheater, and we end up looking in the forum for BUSTED next to the allegation. I'm not so sure there really is any humiliation if he's not forced to admit it in front of his peers. Just my .02 worth.

john1099 · Post by **john1099** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:10 pm

robbart wrote: You know what is a good thing? Draw attention to it, and watch as the number of cheaters dwindles. I think that is a good direction.

I just wanted to address this.
In a town, someone steals something from the store. In response, the police are called, the man is caught, convicted and it hits the local papers.
Does this mean he will not do this again? Probably not.
Even though the bad reputation is now present, it really does not stop people from stealing (in this case making more accounts)
I agree with you somewhat, but some good players are actually ex-multi's, who have paid their $20, and been able to play again!

Ps. I did read your first post, and every one in this thread, interesting topic, but I didn't agree with it.
Thanks,
John

robbart · Post by **robbart** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 8:47 pm

john1099 wrote:
robbart wrote: You know what is a good thing? Draw attention to it, and watch as the number of cheaters dwindles. I think that is a good direction.
I just wanted to address this.
In a town, someone steals something from the store. In response, the police are called, the man is caught, convicted and it hits the local papers.
Does this mean he will not do this again? Probably not.
Even though the bad reputation is now present, it really does not stop people from stealing (in this case making more accounts)
I agree with you somewhat, but some good players are actually ex-multi's, who have paid their $20, and been able to play again!

Ps. I did read your first post, and every one in this thread, interesting topic, but I didn't agree with it.
Thanks,
John

John,

Ok, we will agree to disagree. Fair enough.

I can't agree with your comparison. While the police do arrest the crook, and perhaps the fact that his is arrested is posted in a public place, he is not forced to admit what he did, nor is it evident to those he talks to on a daily basis. The fact is, if there were a more public way of showing who the cheaters are, even for a short period of time, I believe it would keep people honest. It's one thing to hide behind some forum entry that most CC'ers aren't going to read. It's quite another if they were branded as such. Can't really hide that now, could you?

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 9:17 pm

first of all i don't agree with cheater being allowed to play again if they buy premium. i've said it before and i'll say it again. this is really crap. it's like an open invitation for cheaters. if i make 10 accounts and cheat my way to 5000 points for one account and then i'm busted i simply pay 20 bucks and i'm number 1 in the rankings. then i retire and i'll forever be conquerer even though i'm a cheater. this is plain wrong.

anyway back on topic. i agree with branding multis as cheaters at least for a period. let's say 1 month. look at it like prison time. a thief is caught stealing he goes to prison (the branding period in our case) and when he comes out nobody knows it unless they searches in his file (searching the forums in our case). why i think this is necessary? simple. even if a cheater is caught and all his extra accounts are played i still don't want a person with such a character play in my games. i see he's a cheater and add him on ignore. simple as that. not to mention wearing such a brand would discourage people to cheat. i mean what's the point of cheating when the account you worked for wears the Cheater brand?

but this will probably never be approved. why? simple a cheater will not pay 20$ if he knows he'll wear the cheater brand. i'd be more than happy to see ads on the site if lack needs the money then to play with cheaters that pay to play.