Merged: Standardized Tournament Labels

Coleman · Post by **Coleman** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:19 pm

The change is that your tournament privileges are locked into a specific tournament name that you specified when requesting them. This decreases the potential for abuse of tournament privileges by using them to create unofficial tournament games and stops people that like to give 50 different names to the same tournament. (Which I have always found annoying and recently stopped doing myself.)

Forza AZ · Post by **Forza AZ** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:21 pm

Coleman wrote:It's fixed now, I'm liking the new system a lot, people can't post 20 different names for the same tourney anymore or host tournaments they aren't supposed to while they have privileges.

Well, I don't like this. I always give different names for each game in a tournament, so it's clear to what round and what teams the game belongs.

About privileges for each tournament, that is OK with me, but isn't it possible that you can add an extra text for each game next to the standard name for that tournament?

Wild_Tiger · Post by **Wild_Tiger** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:24 pm

yep still not fixed, now I would have to check every game individually to see if they are finished or if people joined and who has won instead of seeing all at the same time.

Cannot expect people to give a tournament just 1 name (its easier if you can use china vs Poland and such in the title but with this, thats made impossible without a lot of a hassle.

Gilligan · Post by **Gilligan** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:26 pm

How are we supposed to type in a new tournament in the Start a Game if there is a drop down arrow? Because in the arrow, it only says 3 Man Madness, and I am organizing 4 Man Madness as well, and can't start any games for it.

Forza AZ · Post by **Forza AZ** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:27 pm

Coleman wrote:The change is that your tournament privileges are locked into a specific tournament name that you specified when requesting them. This decreases the potential for abuse of tournament privileges by using them to create unofficial tournament games and stops people that like to give 50 different names to the same tournament. (Which I have always found annoying and recently stopped doing myself.)

Well, the first thing is OK for me. I started new tournaments without previously notifying the staff, but think the idea of asking for the right for each new tournament is OK.

The 2nd I'm not happy about. I give different names to each game in a tournament (off course the first part is the same so you see which tournament it is directly), to make clear which round and with match the game belongs to, which also makes it easier to keep track of the scoring for me.
So I really would like it if you can some extra text to a tournament game:

So for instance:

xxx tournament (as standard)
round 1, game 1 player x-player y (as addition)

Coleman · Post by **Coleman** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:30 pm

Gilligan wrote:How are we supposed to type in a new tournament in the Start a Game if there is a drop down arrow? Because in the arrow, it only says 3 Man Madness, and I am organizing 4 Man Madness as well, and can't start any games for it.

You have to ask Ak_Iceman or Hugh to give you 4 Man Madness access privileges.

yorkiepeter · Post by **yorkiepeter** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:30 pm

This is truly horrible. I often do partial name searches. For example, in my 1 v 1 tournament, if i want to see 1 players games i type in 1 v 1 div 1 yor, to check out a whole division to make sure people are joining games as they should i would key in just 1 v 1 div 1. I even ask my participants to do that. This is totally unworkable. What the hell was wrong with partial name searches? Please please please please please lack can we have it back?

Gilligan · Post by **Gilligan** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 1:59 pm

Coleman wrote:
Gilligan wrote:How are we supposed to type in a new tournament in the Start a Game if there is a drop down arrow? Because in the arrow, it only says 3 Man Madness, and I am organizing 4 Man Madness as well, and can't start any games for it.
You have to ask Ak_Iceman or Hugh to give you 4 Man Madness access privileges.

Yeah, but I already started 168 games under it

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 2:14 pm

Hmmm....I still don't know what to think. I like breaking my games down into division by adding the extra tag, but I also like the idea of the powers that be having a little more control.

I have always notified AK_iceman of each of my tournaments, so they are all legit, but only one of them is showing up at the moment. I figure the rest must be on their way.

I guess I'll reserve my judgment to see how it plays out in the end.

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 2:17 pm

I still think it is going to cause some trouble for most. Those of us with large tournaments with players divided into divisions are going to have to search through so extremely long lists when keeping track of games.

lackattack · Post by **lackattack** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 2:24 pm

Hold on I'm still working on this stuff.

lackattack · Post by **lackattack** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 3:54 pm

UPDATE

So after a messy start the new "standardized tournament label system" is in place. Standardization is key to opening up the doors to future enhancements. Here are the changes:

* Improved tool for the Tournament Directors.

* Tournament organizers are given privileges to specific tournament labels and can only create games with those exact labels.

* Tournament organizers can drop waiting tourney games from the game finder.

* Anyone can now drop out of a waiting game from the game finder (yes, this has nothing to do with tournaments).

We still have to do the following:

* Grant missing privileges to organizers with more than one tournament going. If you are missing such privileges please PM a tournament director with the details.

* Clean up the pulldown menu on the game finder to only include standardized tournament labels.

* Some organizers with large tourneys want a way to break down the labels. We need to decide whether to offer multiple privileges (example one label for each division) or add an additional "extra info" free-form text field. Your input on this would be appreciated.

I realize that this transition is causing some inconvenience for current tournament organizers. Please accept my apology and bear with us.

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:05 pm

Ahh, now I feel much better. I don't feel so lost in how to do things now. Thanks for the more detailed explanation Lack, I certainly appreciate it.

As for the field for larger tournament organizers to add a breakdown for "divisions" and stuff, I think it would be a good idea. Perhaps to keep it from getting out of hand the Tournament Directors can have a way to either enable it or not for specific tournaments.

For example. In the tournaments I run, Point Grabbers is one that I do not need to break things down for easy record keeping. However, for my tournaments such as Transformers Wars, Battle for Middle Earth and Cybertronian League, not to mention most of the ones I've already got lined up to go in future months could use a method of breaking it down.

I for one would be willing to have a Tournament Director look at my tournament thread, and decide if they think it is necessary for me to have a secondary field. I would also be willing to make a list of the "labels" I will need and provide them to the Tournament Directors at the proper times.

In the end, I can make it work the way it is, but I will be completely honest in that it will add a significant amount of time to keeping track of my records. I make sure to completely create my record keeping system prior to announcing a tournament in order to expedite the process and keep the games flowing quickly and efficiently. However, with the new system as it currently is I can always create a new process for myself to use.

I hope that input is of help.

Regards, Optimus Prime

yorkiepeter · Post by **yorkiepeter** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:25 pm

Still not happy. Was this really necessary? We Tournament Organisers give up our free time voluntarily to run tournaments to improve hopefully add some more interest to the site. In the last month, I have twice had my privys taken away and have had to do battle to get them back. Now I have lost them again for 2 of my tournaments, and yes ok I will pm the td and eventually it will be sorted out. But it just seems like more and more obstacles are put in the way of organisers. This will cost me many hours to reorganise and i fear that my 1 v 1 tournament may never now conclude.

Here is the link.

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=23545

lack if you could look at the instructions for playing the tournament and the way I have set the games up, you may understand my point.

It has been 4 weeks in the making and this afternoon i spent 2 hours creating all the games, thank goodness i finished just before this new obstacle was put in place.

I ask again, was this really necessary, I didn't see any abuse of powers by organisers, just a bunch of guys trying to promote the site. If anyone does abuse the privys they could just be taken away anyway.

A sad day indeed

Forza AZ · Post by **Forza AZ** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:27 pm

lackattack wrote: We still have to do the following:

* Grant missing privileges to organizers with more than one tournament going. If you are missing such privileges please PM a tournament director with the details.

* Some organizers with large tourneys want a way to break down the labels. We need to decide whether to offer multiple privileges (example one label for each division) or add an additional "extra info" free-form text field. Your input on this would be appreciated.

OK, thanks for the explanation. I already PM'ed you back with the tournament titles for which I miss the privileges at the moment.

And I would really like it when there will be an "extra-info" text field. That will really help me keeping track better of my tournament games.

Forza AZ · Post by **Forza AZ** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:32 pm

yorkiepeter wrote:I ask again, was this really necessary, I didn't see any abuse of powers by organisers, just a bunch of guys trying to promote the site. If anyone does abuse the privys they could just be taken away anyway.

A sad day indeed

I agree. An anouncement of these changes would also have been nice. It's much more difficult to keep track of my games now. If there won't be a way to give more detailed titles to games in the tournaments, then I am really considering to quit organising tournaments from now on. It will just be much more difficult and timeconsuming to keep track of things this way.

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:37 pm

Don't forget that you can easily narrow down your search using a player name. This is especially useful if you are running a round-robin tournament or any other set-up that requires the same group to play multiple times.

It will also work easily with doubles and triples. I think the biggest concern it causes is for tournaments where that type of format is not used.

Bean_ · Post by **Bean_** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:44 pm

yorkiepeter wrote:This is truly horrible. I often do partial name searches. For example, in my 1 v 1 tournament, if i want to see 1 players games i type in 1 v 1 div 1 yor, to check out a whole division to make sure people are joining games as they should i would key in just 1 v 1 div 1. I even ask my participants to do that. This is totally unworkable. What the hell was wrong with partial name searches? Please please please please please lack can we have it back?

I concur, even only as a participant. One of the tournaments I am in, I can look at the status of all games simply by typing "@" into the search box. Another one, by typing "Asian." Moreover, I actually have to resize my browser window and move it in order to use the full drop-down menu; otherwise, I can only get down to the "M"s. This is two steps backward from a user interface perspective. The old text search box should at least be added back as an option.

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:48 pm

Bean_ wrote:I concur, even only as a participant. One of the tournaments I am in, I can look at the status of all games simply by typing "@" into the search box. Another one, by typing "Asian." Moreover, I actually have to resize my browser window and move it in order to use the full drop-down menu; otherwise, I can only get down to the "M"s. This is two steps backward from a user interface perspective. The old text search box should at least be added back as an option.

If you click on the dropdown box in the Game Finder and actually type the first letter or two, it will jump right to where you need to be without costing you hardly any time at all.

kendoh99 · Post by **kendoh99** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 4:59 pm

Bean_ wrote:
yorkiepeter wrote:This is truly horrible. I often do partial name searches. For example, in my 1 v 1 tournament, if i want to see 1 players games i type in 1 v 1 div 1 yor, to check out a whole division to make sure people are joining games as they should i would key in just 1 v 1 div 1. I even ask my participants to do that. This is totally unworkable. What the hell was wrong with partial name searches? Please please please please please lack can we have it back?
I concur, even only as a participant. One of the tournaments I am in, I can look at the status of all games simply by typing "@" into the search box. Another one, by typing "Asian." Moreover, I actually have to resize my browser window and move it in order to use the full drop-down menu; otherwise, I can only get down to the "M"s. This is two steps backward from a user interface perspective. The old text search box should at least be added back as an option.

i agree and the extra info woiuld make it much easier to organixe my league

here:- http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20851

Forza AZ · Post by **Forza AZ** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 5:11 pm

Optimus Prime wrote:Don't forget that you can easily narrow down your search using a player name. This is especially useful if you are running a round-robin tournament or any other set-up that requires the same group to play multiple times.

It will also work easily with doubles and triples. I think the biggest concern it causes is for tournaments where that type of format is not used.

Yes, but using a partial tournament name was so easy. I have all bookmarks for my tournaments and with a few clicks I could see all games which were waiting, active or finished. It's much more work now to search for them.

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 5:25 pm

I cannot argue with you there. I hadn't thought of bookmarks, should have done that a long time ago.

AndrewB · Post by **AndrewB** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 5:29 pm

What about clan games? How we are going to start them, if you can only start games in your tournament label?

So instead of sorting out a LONG LONG time outstanding issue with clan games, lack has decided to fix tournament system, what didn't need fixing. LOL Get your priorities straighten out.

I had run 2 public tournaments in order to get those tournament privileges to use it in my clan games. Obviously it was the last time I run the tournament. As well as I will consider not to invest any more of my time into completing the ongoing tournament.

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 5:30 pm

AndrewB wrote:I had run 2 public tournaments in order to get those tournament privileges to use it in my clan games. Obviously it was the last time I run the tournament. As well as I will consider not to invest any more of my time into completing the ongoing tournament.

Ouch, that's pretty unfair to all those players if you ask me.

yorkiepeter · Post by **yorkiepeter** » Mon Jul 23, 2007 5:42 pm

Forza AZ wrote:
yorkiepeter wrote:I ask again, was this really necessary, I didn't see any abuse of powers by organisers, just a bunch of guys trying to promote the site. If anyone does abuse the privys they could just be taken away anyway.

A sad day indeed
If there won't be a way to give more detailed titles to games in the tournaments, then I am really considering to quit organising tournaments from now on.

Me too. I will continue with the world championship as it is well on the way to reaching a climax, but I have just started 2 others that i really need to give more detailed titles to. Fortunately I have just created a load of games for them and won't need to create anymore for 2 weeks, but if this isn't sorted by then I will have to abandon them as i really cannot afford the extra time it will take to organise them.

On completion of my world championship tournament I will resign from organising tournaments as it is getting more and more difficult. Still with hardly any organisers left should make the job of the td a lot easier.

In conclusion I have to express how disappointed I am that organisers were not even consulted on this.

bad show guys