gay - is it ok?

[b.k. barunt]

i would feel indifferent in company of gay who behaves like regular guy...

All the gay people I know... You're painting with such a broad brush, as it's been put. Most gay people are not prancing around in spandex talking in a high voice with a lisp. They're just regular guys like you and me. Well... You at least.

BK, what does one have to do to become a Christian then? Seems like it's pretty hard to me!

To be a Muslim, you follow (live your life by) the Quran. To be a Hindu, you follow the Vedas. To be a Christian, you follow the Bible. Not that complicated.

[hecter]

i would feel indifferent in company of gay who behaves like regular guy...

All the gay people I know... You're painting with such a broad brush, as it's been put. Most gay people are not prancing around in spandex talking in a high voice with a lisp. They're just regular guys like you and me. Well... You at least.

BK, what does one have to do to become a Christian then? Seems like it's pretty hard to me!

To be a Muslim, you follow (live your life by) the Quran. To be a Hindu, you follow the Vedas. To be a Christian, you follow the Bible. Not that complicated.

Well, everybody's a sinner BK. Every Christian, every Muslim, every Hindu, every Buddhist, ect. Some people lie, others cheat, others are lustful... Gays just have a very obvious sin, if you consider it that (I know some Christians don't) of having sex with another man. So, why can't these gay people practise their sin and still be Christian, when every other Christian in the world practises theirs?

[jay_a2j]

And I am saying yes, a homosexual should give up sex with the same sex if they want to follow God's commandments. If they don't, well then nothing should stand in their way.

But that's ridiculous. You're saying there are no true Christian gays. And unless you're one of those Westboro Baptist people, surely you believe that your God is a loving one. So why would he want to stop love, gay or otherwise? And I'm not talking about casual sex, I'm talking about true love between a couple of the same sex.

Don't know, don't care. God's probably a dick.


Though I do have a question for Jay. Isn't it only God's job to pass judgement on anyone regarding their life? If someone who is gay chooses to worship God ,but doesn't stop having sex, shouldn't you just accept that and let God be the judge?

I think the underlined part clearly addresses this question. The Bible states, "homosexuals (among other things) will not inherit the kingdom of God". So, a practicing homosexual can worship God all they want.... scripture remains the same. For a person to state "There is nothing morally wrong with homosexuality and God is ok with it" is a false statement. However, God has given us free will. We have to choose, "whom we will serve".....God or self?

[hecter]

Snorri, you're right. God is a dick.

[Simonov]

And I am saying yes, a homosexual should give up sex with the same sex if they want to follow God's commandments. If they don't, well then nothing should stand in their way.

But that's ridiculous. You're saying there are no true Christian gays. And unless you're one of those Westboro Baptist people, surely you believe that your God is a loving one. So why would he want to stop love, gay or otherwise? And I'm not talking about casual sex, I'm talking about true love between a couple of the same sex.

Don't know, don't care. God's probably a dick.


Though I do have a question for Jay. Isn't it only God's job to pass judgement on anyone regarding their life? If someone who is gay chooses to worship God ,but doesn't stop having sex, shouldn't you just accept that and let God be the judge?

I think the underlined part clearly addresses this question. The Bible states, "homosexuals (among other things) will not inherit the kingdom of God". So, a practicing homosexual can worship God all they want.... scripture remains the same. For a person to state "There is nothing morally wrong with homosexuality and God is ok with it" is a false statement. However, God has given us free will. We have to choose, "whom we will serve".....God or self?

bible says a lot of crap to be sincere. look at this attitudes towards women:
http://www.nobeliefs.com/DarkBible/darkbible7.htm

do u believe in those to jay? no one normal would? you must realize that bible was re-written by human hand many times to serve to certain people's interests.

[jay_a2j]

And I am saying yes, a homosexual should give up sex with the same sex if they want to follow God's commandments. If they don't, well then nothing should stand in their way.

But that's ridiculous. You're saying there are no true Christian gays. And unless you're one of those Westboro Baptist people, surely you believe that your God is a loving one. So why would he want to stop love, gay or otherwise? And I'm not talking about casual sex, I'm talking about true love between a couple of the same sex.

Don't know, don't care. God's probably a dick.


Though I do have a question for Jay. Isn't it only God's job to pass judgement on anyone regarding their life? If someone who is gay chooses to worship God ,but doesn't stop having sex, shouldn't you just accept that and let God be the judge?

I think the underlined part clearly addresses this question. The Bible states, "homosexuals (among other things) will not inherit the kingdom of God". So, a practicing homosexual can worship God all they want.... scripture remains the same. For a person to state "There is nothing morally wrong with homosexuality and God is ok with it" is a false statement. However, God has given us free will. We have to choose, "whom we will serve".....God or self?

bible says a lot of crap to be sincere. look at this attitudes towards women:
http://www.nobeliefs.com/DarkBible/darkbible7.htm

do u believe in those to jay? no one normal would? you must realize that bible was re-written by human hand many times to serve to certain people's interests.

I won't get into it, as it will deviate from the subject at hand. (thread-jacking) But society has gotten further and further away from scripture. We have become "enlightened" while the "normal" people live in caves and follow some 2000 year old book.

[unriggable]

Not really, you can be both, it's just a matter of how much you follow the bible. A lot of priests do not believe in the scripture literally at all.

[Snorri1234]

And I am saying yes, a homosexual should give up sex with the same sex if they want to follow God's commandments. If they don't, well then nothing should stand in their way.

But that's ridiculous. You're saying there are no true Christian gays. And unless you're one of those Westboro Baptist people, surely you believe that your God is a loving one. So why would he want to stop love, gay or otherwise? And I'm not talking about casual sex, I'm talking about true love between a couple of the same sex.

Don't know, don't care. God's probably a dick.


Though I do have a question for Jay. Isn't it only God's job to pass judgement on anyone regarding their life? If someone who is gay chooses to worship God ,but doesn't stop having sex, shouldn't you just accept that and let God be the judge?

I think the underlined part clearly addresses this question. The Bible states, "homosexuals (among other things) will not inherit the kingdom of God". So, a practicing homosexual can worship God all they want.... scripture remains the same. For a person to state "There is nothing morally wrong with homosexuality and God is ok with it" is a false statement. However, God has given us free will. We have to choose, "whom we will serve".....God or self?

The bible also states that people who work on Sabbath should be put to death and that women should be subjugated by their husbands. As unriggable said, there are many people who follow the teachings of christ but don't think any of that is wrong. Since the bible has actually been proven to be wrong on several accounts, why should we take the reference to homosexuals literaly? (Not to mention that it isn't even a very clear reference.)

[spurgistan]

Exactly. A gay person (or one who collects usury, wears clothes of mixed fibers, doesn't play a ten-stringed harp, and so on) can be considered a Christian by following the spirit of the words rather than the actual letter. If your definition of "good Christendom" is reserved for those who follow all the laws (like this guy, for example, then power to you. There are a lot of rules in the Bible that just don't really make much sense. The concept that a gay person will violate God's will any more than a wearer of mixed fibers (oh, the comfort!) is moot. Honestly, I doubt He still cares about that stuff.

[b.k. barunt]

i would feel indifferent in company of gay who behaves like regular guy...

All the gay people I know... You're painting with such a broad brush, as it's been put. Most gay people are not prancing around in spandex talking in a high voice with a lisp. They're just regular guys like you and me. Well... You at least.

BK, what does one have to do to become a Christian then? Seems like it's pretty hard to me!

To be a Muslim, you follow (live your life by) the Quran. To be a Hindu, you follow the Vedas. To be a Christian, you follow the Bible. Not that complicated.

Well, everybody's a sinner BK. Every Christian, every Muslim, every Hindu, every Buddhist, ect. Some people lie, others cheat, others are lustful... Gays just have a very obvious sin, if you consider it that (I know some Christians don't) of having sex with another man. So, why can't these gay people practise their sin and still be Christian, when every other Christian in the world practises theirs?

The key word is "practise". All people slip up every now and then, but to consistently "practice" something that is against the scriptures is to deny their influence in your life. As most professing "Christians" don't even know the Bible, much less follow it, this is a moot point. Btw, why would a gay person want to embace a religion that marked his life style as evil? That would be like the Pork Sausage King wanting to be Muslim. Go figure.


Honibaz

[Napoleon Ier]

i would feel indifferent in company of gay who behaves like regular guy...

All the gay people I know... You're painting with such a broad brush, as it's been put. Most gay people are not prancing around in spandex talking in a high voice with a lisp. They're just regular guys like you and me. Well... You at least.

BK, what does one have to do to become a Christian then? Seems like it's pretty hard to me!

To be a Muslim, you follow (live your life by) the Quran. To be a Hindu, you follow the Vedas. To be a Christian, you follow the Bible. Not that complicated.

your analysis, b.k. barunt, falls apart. Christian is simply meant to mean adhereing to Christ's teachings. However dispute over what the Bible's text should be must be considered, non-belief in Biblical authority is compatible with Christian belief, and you effectively (probably, if I know you, very concsiously) exclude Roman Catholics from your definition. Effectively your definition is a classic example of manifestation of reformationist extremism that has polluted the Faith, the pathetic sola scriptura culture of ignorance being applied to define Christians.

[peanutsdad]

This thread seems to have been hijacked into a contimplation on what it takes to be a christian or what ever religion you follow. It seemed to me that he was asking how people felt around homosexuals, or if you prefer gay people. There seemed to be in reading through the posts that some thought that all "gay's" are flameing spandex wearing lisps talking, slap you on the ass flamboyantly wanting to change you into another gay type of people. in actuallity from the experiences i've had through out life ( yes in the SF bay area) that unless the person told you they were gay, you didn't even know. The grand thought that anyone can be or should be pigionhold into such a streotype actually really bothers me. then there's the conversations about scripture this and scripture that, HEY!!!!! All the religions out there are following books written by MEN!!! some dating back thousands of years. Now you really want to trust that they always wrote down correctly what they supposedly were told by what ever there "GOD" might have been... Come on, you can't even get 30 adults in one room to pass the same 10 word sentence from one another correctly to the end. And you want to believe everything that whatever book your reading from is the law of all laws....In reality, it only took one MORON passing the wrong info on to another to screw the whole thing up. for all we all know, if there really was a higher being that said any of what any of the vast religions say they said, it might be very different.....

Oh, yeah, the base of this thread again... I don't mind being around anyone, whether there gay, straight, transgendered, eunuch, or whatever......

sorry about the ramble..... adhd....

[Jehan]

to answer the original question, i'm pretty sure i wouldn't notice someone as gay unless they were in fact kisssing a guy, i'm pretty dull that way, and to be honest i'm ok with that, because as much as i say i dont judge people for their choices, i seem to have that inescapable human flaw of being uncomfortable around things i'm not used to, so yeah, wouldn't notice, but if i did, they'd have to be pretty flamboyant, which would probably make me uneasy, though i'm working on it.

On the Christian thing, jay and bk have it down, you make a choice to follow God, its the same as making the choice to not live in sin, and that doesn't relate to not sinning, because we all stuff up, its about the choice that you make to not want to sin, its like you cant serve two masters at once.

[peanutsdad]

to answer the original question, i'm pretty sure i wouldn't notice someone as gay unless they were in fact kisssing a guy, i'm pretty dull that way, and to be honest i'm ok with that, because as much as i say i dont judge people for their choices, i seem to have that inescapable human flaw of being uncomfortable around things i'm not used to, so yeah, wouldn't notice, but if i did, they'd have to be pretty flamboyant, which would probably make me uneasy, though i'm working on it.

On the Christian thing, jay and bk have it down, you make a choice to follow God, its the same as making the choice to not live in sin, and that doesn't relate to not sinning, because we all stuff up, its about the choice that you make to not want to sin, its like you cant serve two masters at once.

I am not picking on you, so please don't take it that way. But why does is being gay always described as "two guys kissing"? I'm wondering, would people be more comfortable around 2 gay women rather than 2 gay men? And if so why? Is it that they (ok i'm referring primarily to men here) just feel threatened by other gay men, but not gay women? After all, you always hear it's hot to watch 2 women kiss, but you never hear that of 2 men. And no, i'm not saying i think thats hot either, it's just an example Muy.......

[Jehan]

to be honest, any couple kissing, i find, is an awkward social situation, man and woman, man and man, woman and woman.

[luns101]

I'm not sure what Simonov meant when he said, "is it ok", but I do think that homosexuality is a choice and that it is an abnormal behavior.

[peanutsdad]

I'm not sure what Simonov meant when he said, "is it ok", but I do think that homosexuality is a choice and that it is an abnormal behavior.

Ahhh, and everyone is intitled to there own opinion. Although i completely disagree with yours. I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree, cause i'm soooooooo not getting into that argument today.......

[Jehan]

that argument is pointless anyway, Christians wont want to convince other people not to sin, that's silly, we want to convince people to follow Christ the rest follows, when i get time I'll post an article from my uni magazine, written by a guy who used to be gay, till he became a Christian, and then he chose to change his lifestyle. I mean that if a Christian was telling sinners to stop sinning, which no one here was doing, they wouldn't be doing what they should be doing.

[F1fth]

that argument is pointless anyway, Christians wont want to convince other people not to sin, that's silly, we want to convince people to follow Christ the rest follows, when i get time I'll post an article from my uni magazine, written by a guy who used to be gay, till he became a Christian, and then he chose to change his lifestyle. I mean that if a Christian was telling sinners to stop sinning, which no one here was doing, they wouldn't be doing what they should be doing.

There needs to be more Christians like you. If there were, I might give it a shot.

[Backglass]

Christians wont want to convince other people not to sin, that's silly, we want to convince people to follow Christ the rest follows, when i get time I'll post an article from my uni magazine, written by a guy who used to be gay, till he became a Christian, and then he chose to change his lifestyle. I mean that if a Christian was telling sinners to stop sinning, which no one here was doing, they wouldn't be doing what they should be doing.

So can we stop the anti-abortion protests at the womens clinics then?

[Stopper]

Maybe the thread has gone in a bit of a pointless direction, but...

I'm not sure what Simonov meant when he said, "is it ok", but I do think that homosexuality is a choice and that it is an abnormal behavior.

...I'm curious to know what you mean by "a choice", luns.

I've heard of both environmental and biological causes being assigned to homosexuality - and particularly some Christians have said that the environmental causes are such that homosexuality can be reversed by appropriate behavioural modification, and whatever other, therapy. Not something I'd agree with, by the way.

But a choice? That's a bit much to swallow, old fellow. I can't imagine choosing to find either women or men attractive.

I admit, sometimes, on seeing a glimpse of Clint Eastwood's mean demeanour - even now, when he's getting past it a bit - to getting a brief tingle in my loins, but I doubt I could choose to want to "present" to him.

So what do you mean?

[Jehan]

Christians wont want to convince other people not to sin, that's silly, we want to convince people to follow Christ the rest follows, when i get time I'll post an article from my uni magazine, written by a guy who used to be gay, till he became a Christian, and then he chose to change his lifestyle. I mean that if a Christian was telling sinners to stop sinning, which no one here was doing, they wouldn't be doing what they should be doing.

So can we stop the anti-abortion protests at the womens clinics then?

haha, you have a knack for finding the grey areas don't you,
well i don't think so, because they really believe that to abort a baby is to kill it, and i would want them to act out of love for the child to try and stop the abortions from happening. In this case the protest isn't so much about stopping sin, as trying to save someone, whether you agree with them or not, you should be able to see, that if someone believed abortion was murder, then they would try and do something about it.

[luns101]

...I'm curious to know what you mean by "a choice", luns.

One who has a sexual desire for someone of the same gender and physically acts upon it.

-EDIT-

I admit, sometimes, on seeing a glimpse of Clint Eastwood's mean demeanour - even now, when he's getting past it a bit - to getting a brief tingle in my loins, but I doubt I could choose to want to "present" to him.

Which Clint Eastwood film are you talking about?

[Stopper]

...I'm curious to know what you mean by "a choice", luns.

One who has a sexual desire for someone of the same gender and physically acts upon it.

A desire isn't a choice, so I assume you mean that the actual practice of homosexuality is a choice. Well, in so far that sex, either way, is a choice for anyone, I'd have to agree, bearing in mind that nearly everyone is unable to resist the desire to have sex.

Plus, it's also "abnormal", in the strict sense that most people are not homosexual.

So all in all, it appears I agree with you!

Homosexuality FTW!

-EDIT-

I admit, sometimes, on seeing a glimpse of Clint Eastwood's mean demeanour - even now, when he's getting past it a bit - to getting a brief tingle in my loins, but I doubt I could choose to want to "present" to him.

Which Clint Eastwood film are you talking about?

If it came down to a film, I'd have to go for Dirty Harry. It was the way he held his massive weapon.

[unriggable]

I'm not sure what Simonov meant when he said, "is it ok", but I do think that homosexuality is a choice and that it is an abnormal behavior.

Who would choose to be gay in such a hostile environment?