[GP] [Rules] Eliminate Deferred Troops

[Krueger]

I'm a little late to the conversation and someone may have said this (no, I did not read all 11 pages).

But what if we changed it so that if you miss three turns total instead of three consecutive turns that you would get the boot? That way people would be less inclined to use it as a strategy in game play.

I had a game where in 19 rounds one person missed 5 turns before he or she was eliminated, that makes the game take too long if one person is using the miss turn strategy.

[remydog]

So, just checking, is there really no one besides me and Derwidle who believes that getting your armies multiplied for turns you missed is ridiculous? I think that if you miss your turn it's your fault and have no one to blame for it but yourself. There's no reason why you should be afforded a chance to greatly rebuild what you've lost by getting your armies multiplied. Thoughts?

I completely agree.

Missing a turn (or more than one) creates two significant problems. First, it wastes everyone else's time while they wait for your time to end. It is really agonizing for all the other players.

Second, it is unfair that when you do get your turn, you now have twice as many armies to deploy than everyone else for a given round. This is particularly problematic early when most of us are only getting 3 or 4 armies.

While by missing a turn you lose the chance to advance, expand, get cards, etc, early in the game, these are not as important as consolidating your territory. If you get a big slug of armies all at once, you can really disrupt another player's strategy, even if you're not doing so intentionally.

I am currently in a no-cards game (last one I will ever do). There are two players frequently missing their turns and /or waiting until nearly 24 hours is up before playing. It is like watching paint dry. I can't say if they are doing it on purpose, but it is agonizing. Even more so when they have twice as many armies to play on their next turn.

If you get all that you would have had anyway, then it is no penalty at all to miss a turn, which does not create any dis-incentive.

I think this has to change.

[loopinvariant]

Giving a player armies when they have missed turns is the biggest bull-wasteproduct feature I have ever seen in a game.

I don't care "how many times this has been brought up", that is not an argument to stop the discussion. It only shows how messed up the feature is when people are that unhappy about it.

I've been in many games where it is used as a weapon. Repeatedly, in the same game.

I don't care what your reason for missing turns is, if it is significant enough to warrant you missing the turn then you've expressed your priorities and made your choice so deal with it.

Make it a game option. If you want to use it, fine -- we know which games to avoid because only the cheaters will be using it.

[flexmaster33]

I believe that the random deployment or reduced deployment is the best answer...For reduced I'm thinking just make it half of what they would have received. That way they have an incentive to return, but it doesn't shift the power for those who miss on purpose.

Of course if it's random, it achieves the same idea...simply forcing the player to use a few turns of fortifying to put the armies where they want...plus this should get rid of the problem of a major attack early in the game.

Either way, something should be done. I can understand missed turns...but missing on purpose is one of the most frustrating things that happens on this game...if there some sort of minor penalty is incurred, then there is no reason to miss on purpose.

[Rocketry]

Lack's already stated that this feature will not be removed. It was suggested, and rejected. See so in the Suggestions Box.


--Andy

I hope ou have an iron will. If your feeling weak anytime, drop me a PM and i'll go burn down their house.... am i trolling again? shhh Rocket.

What i mean to say is ia agree that this feature should remain as-is. Keep up the good work.

Rocketry

[nudge]

I personally hate it when players miss turns and come back with double men the next round. This can really turn a game. Admitably it is risky to miss a turn but many players can use it to their advantage, especially in the larger maps.

I would like to suggest either one off the following be adopted in a future upgrade:

1. Missed turns are allowed but the person who misses doesn't receive the missed turn men or

2. A tick box when we create a game that allows the game creator to turn on or off the ability to have miss turn men doubled.

[spiesr]

Discuss this here.

[loopinvariant]

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 005#872005

Since the site management is so confident that most people want the deadbeat bonus, make it a game option and that will solve things.

The "minority" of people that hate it will not start/join games with the deadbeat bonus, and those that do want it will of course be able to find the majority of games that have it enabled.

And you'll have the nice side effect of not hearing that vocal minority constantly telling you how much they want to get rid if it.

So why the fear? Why the resistance to putting it in? Keep the deadbeat bonus but make it a game option and everyone will be happy by whatever logic you wish to apply.

Unless there is a different reason?

It would take less time to implement this feature than it does to keep dealing with all the threads that keep expressing the dislike for the deadbeat bonus.

[nudge]

I personally hate it when players miss turns and come back with double men the next round. This can really turn a game. Admitably it is risky to miss a turn but many players can use it to their advantage, especially in the larger maps.

I would like to suggest either one off the following be adopted in a future upgrade:

1. Missed turns are allowed but the person who misses doesn't receive the missed turn men or

2. A tick box when we create a game that allows the game creator to turn on or off the ability to have miss turn men doubled.

[BlackIrish]

Lack's already stated that this feature will not be removed. It was suggested, and rejected. See so in the Suggestions Box.


--Andy

[End Thread]

This thread should have been locked after that post lol

[Trevor33]

114 yes
48 no

pretty conclusive i'd say.

[Herakilla]

talk about necromancy this died in the summer

[Kaplowitz]

This was designed to be a casual site and therefore there are no penalties for missing a turn or two.

Maybe you shouldnt get any armies in a Speed game.

[longboreder]

This was designed to be a casual site and therefore there are no penalties for missing a turn or two.

Maybe you shouldnt get any armies in a Speed game.

agreed. I can understand the idea behind not penalizing players in casual games for missed turns, but a speed game is a different story. Deadbeatting to gain double or triple armies in a speed game seems counter to the idea of it being a "speed" game.

[Jade Empire]

The missed turns multiplier is in need of reform. I understand that we're trying to promote a casual experience, but there needs to be some kind of discouragement for the missing of turns. The current system encourages them in most cases.

-Firstly, the rule should not apply to speed games at all. I think everyone is in clear agreeance with that, so why isn't it made to be?

For casual games, I would prefer it to be abolished completely but since there's a significant minority of users in favour of keeping it, a comprimise should be made. How about an allowance of 1 missed turn bonus per player, per game? Or even an allowance of 2... After that, you gotta suck it up! It's called Conquer Club, not Compassion Club. Instead of thinking of it as 'punishment', think of it as encouragement to take your turn.

[pascalleke]

Lack's already stated that this feature will not be removed. It was suggested, and rejected. See so in the Suggestions Box.


--Andy

[End Thread]

This thread should have been locked after that post lol

if this is thrue why is it in his to do list???????

[pascalleke]

I like options 1 or 2 myself.

any ground for your "i like "

multipliers just ruin good games : thats my ground as you can see in my games list

[musteriuz]

Hi.

I feel that some people are taking serious advantage of the "miss one turn and get double your armies next time" rule. If you miss a turn, some players may think you're going to deadbeat and ignore you for a while, therefore when you come back you have an advantage similar to playing a set of cards - bonus armies.

I believe that if someone misses a turn, that should be it: they missed a turn and have to play the next one like everyone else.

(Sorry if this is on here somewhere already, but I'm not looking through 78 forum pages to find out).

Regards.

[misterman10]

Theres millions of suggestions on whether or not missed turns should reward army. However, in no way does it give you, "Bonus" armies for missing turns. It appears that way because you get more armies in that one turn. However, you either get the same amount of armies (or less) by missing a turn.

[spiesr]

Please thoroughly read the following threads and perform a forum search before making suggestions:
Suggestions Box (Lack's 'To-Do' List)
Suggestion & Bug Report Forms

[Leinad]

It may not give you bonus armies, but it absolutely changes the strategy, in a way that I think is unfair, and has no relationship to actual RISK. I just got nearly eliminated from a game because one of the small players got 18 armies at the beginning of the turn due to prior missed turns, then took another turn 9 minutes later and got bonus armies from the continents he captured BEFORE ANYONE HAD A CHANCE TO RECAPTURE THOSE TERRITORIES!!! This is completely unfair. If you want people to take advantage of what looks to be a great idea for a website, then you have to remove the loopholes when they are brought to light. Otherwise people are going to continue to complain. Hopefully somebody will read this and actually care.

Also, the attack button does not seem to be working. I have never destroyed a single enemy army except using auto-attack.

[lackattack]

I think the way to go is Brahms' suggestion with hschroed78's modification to address mach's concerns.

[TheTeacher]

here's the thing: what if people who r fine with the way things r aren't bothering to post or vote on stuff like this? I personally believe there's a silent majority who are fine with the way it is. Typically, when a issue is raised, it's the side who wants things to change that more vigorously fights for their side. The other side, if they aren't well organised (such as the case here, we don't have any secret political parties that organise voting for this kind of stuff, do we?) might not even notice the issue being raised, and won't bother putting their voice to the issue. A large majority of Conquer Club members actually DONT read the forum thouroughly, not even the stickies. they may occasionally start a thread if they have a question or problem, but they won't bother to notice the existance of a thread like this.

Anyhow, i personally agree with the folks suporting the missed turns multiplier. Smart players should be able to anticipate the missed turns multipier. it's only the folks who don't bother to plan their attacks and fortification acording to how many armies others will recieve next turn who complain... all they see is somebody getting a larger amount of armies one turn than they should, which, as they've put it "is rediculous" in their view. When somebody misses a turn, TAKE ADVANTAGE OF IT. because that's what somebody smart can do and will do, and that's the whole reason the missed turn multiplier is there to give the guy a chance to get back up. If you do the math, if somebody takes advantage of u when u miss a turn, even when u get the missed turns multipier, your still at a disadvantage. One could argue that the missed turns multipier should be higher! but I won't go there.

I say leave well enough alone.

P.S. the above argument is based mainly on sequential games. if people are trying to use multipliers to their advantage, which can be done and actually has SOME sence to it in FREESTYLE games, then just leave them a negative feedback and report them in cheating and abuse reports. it's not that hard.

[wicked]

Great post Teacher!

I've been trying to speak up for the silent majority. Personally I believe we'll see just as many complaints if this is changed. Squeaky wheel gets the grease I guess.

[Risktaker17]

I think the there should be no bonus men for missing turns in speed games, but in casual its casual games no penalty should be given.