Suggestion: Better personal info policy

[jbrettlip]

Conquer Club needs a CLEAR, defined personal info policy. This has been debated in a few threads, including some discussion with Twill. My inderstanding is persoanl information can not be used, if it can be liinked to a user. (Not an actual person, but the conquer club username). That is why discussions of Obama are accceptable, he is not a user and not linked to a user name.

However I found out a user received a 3 day suspension for violating personal info, by having a sentence in his signature. Because this same sentence was a title of a user's term paper. The user was not identified, and therefore this broke no rules.

So how about some clarification of what is and what is not allowed?

[jpcloet]

What would you recommend? What areas does it need to cover, sigs, avatars, posts etc.

[timmytuttut88]

There definitely needs to be a line drawn somewhere. You can't say no personal info "EVER" since honestly mods call me "timmy" all the time which is my first name. Why can they do this, but other users can't post someone's avatar?

I know that mods want this because of that whole reminisco thing, but why ban us for posting someones avatar or for posting the title of someones paper in a sig when we don't say who's paper it is?

[jnd94]

I think the line is pretty clear. No personal info. Plain and simple.

[timmytuttut88]

I think the line is pretty clear. No personal info. Plain and simple.

Well it says that you can't say personal info of a user EVER. What stops me from reporting everyone who calls me timmy?

[hecter]

I think the line is pretty clear. No personal info. Plain and simple.

Yup, that's the line. A pretty shitty line, dontcha think? That's the problem, the line is clear, nobody has any issues about where the line is, we just don't like where it is.

[jbrettlip]

If no personal ino is allowed, every Obama,McCain, Palin, ron Paul, Led Zeppelin etc thread must come down. Twill's explanation was info linked to a use was verboten, yet he banned a guy who supposedly had personal info in his sig, with no username attached.

[happy2seeyou]

I think it's funny that we cannot post personal information that is already posted on every users profile. What country we live in is posted, yet Twill states that we are not allowed to mention it. Letting everyone know what country we are from is not an option we are given. CC is broadcasting that "personal information". Once broadcasted by CC, it's no longer "personal".

So I can't tell people that you live in Canada?

No. If wants others to know, he can tell them (or they can look at his country flag). Personal information is the property of the person, not of you and you have no right to give out someone else's information.

Also on each and every profile is the option to list the following: "Location", "Occupation", and "Interests".

[happy2seeyou]

I think the line is pretty clear. No personal info. Plain and simple.

Yup, that's the line. A pretty shitty line, dontcha think? That's the problem, the line is clear, nobody has any issues about where the line is, we just don't like where it is.

The line is not clear. Thats the problem. Personal information could be as simple as me saying that hecter is a male.

[Kotaro]

Here's a crazy, super weird idea.

Don't post personal information about anyone ever, and no one will ever punish you for doing it. Crazy thought, I know, but it just my work.

[timmytuttut88]

Here's a crazy, super weird idea.

Don't post personal information about anyone ever, and no one will ever punish you for doing it. Crazy thought, I know, but it just my work.

So if someone called me "timmy" that would warrant them a ban because that is my first name?

[Kotaro]

So if someone called me "timmy" that would warrant them a ban because that is my first name?

Perhaps. It would also warrant a ban for you, since you seem to like extreme measures, because you posted personal information in your username.

[hecter]

I think the line is pretty clear. No personal info. Plain and simple.

Yup, that's the line. A pretty shitty line, dontcha think? That's the problem, the line is clear, nobody has any issues about where the line is, we just don't like where it is.

The line is not clear. Thats the problem. Personal information could be as simple as me saying that hecter is a male.

I find the line to be quite clear. Personal information is, really, anything identifiable, including the fact that I am male (last time I checked, anyway).

Here's a crazy, super weird idea.

Don't post personal information about anyone ever, and no one will ever punish you for doing it. Crazy thought, I know, but it just my work.

That concept is ludicrous. To enforce the rule, you'd have to do away with any gender specific pronouns, we'd no longer be able to reply to other peoples opinions, we wouldn't be able to say which country other people are from (despite being clear on your profile), it's just silly.

[Kotaro]

Don't post personal information about anyone ever, and no one will ever punish you for doing it. Crazy thought, I know, but it just my work.

That concept is ludicrous. To enforce the rule, you'd have to do away with any gender specific pronouns, we'd no longer be able to reply to other peoples opinions, we wouldn't be able to say which country other people are from (despite being clear on your profile), it's just silly.[/quote]

Again, another example of users acting like complete idiots because they are upset. Everyone knows what is personal information, and what isn't. There is a clear line, despite the thread starters opinion. My age, for example, is private to anyone I want it to be. So is my location (precise), my living arrangements, my public messengers, my full name, my current bank provider, etc. However, my gender is nothing that cannot be identified with half the planet, nor is my (general) location (go Pack go <_<), my IRC channels.

There are obvious, common sense no-no's on the internet; and yet, people keep ignoring them, taking the rules word for word, and attempting to use it against other users. And now DaGip and the Bullet-Proof-Bandits (wfe you call yourselves), are getting super pissy when it comes back to bite you in the ass.

If you want the rule used literally, word for word, than you will have it like it has been, with entire clans being banned at a time without warning. However, if you people ever feel like growing up, pretending to be mature, and using common sense, than the rule won't be so harsh.

[owenshooter]

a clan's sig is banned due to 4 images of members that can be found in various places on the internet, and the users CHOSE to use their images as their avatar and within the sig... however, threads exist in which MODS have posted their personal pics and members have posted and reposted their personal pics, and are encouraged to do so without any sort of repercussion. my understanding of the rule is that if we CHOOSE to post our image somewhere, we are allowed to, but others are not. is this incorrect? i have yet to find an answer to this question, but in the process of asking it, i was banned for 24 hours and all the members of my clan were banned for 24 hours, without warning. so, basically, i think it shold be if the members of my clan choose to post their images within our clan sig, that is ok. but if others choose to post their images as avatars, flames, etc, that is not ok. somewhere, somehow, someone needs to make a sound decision on this. why? an entire clan has had to remove a sig that had pretty much been part of the forum in one shape or form for a solid year without any warning, and multiple threads exist in which members break this rule on a daily basis without punishment. with the new "STACHE'D" precident set on the BpB for posting of personal info, these members and a few mods should be waking up to forum bans as the members of our clan did. different rules for different members does not work. if i am allowed to CHOOSE where to use my image, i should be able to CHOOSE to use it within my clans sig, as i have done for the past year (we used the sig when there were 5 of us, before we were official, and the forum bullies beat us up on a regular basis)... sure, i just made this personal to my own AGENDA, but it is how the odd moderation of this site is affecting me and my clanmates at the moment... the black jesus has rambled..-0

p.s.-brett wrote a paper in high school for german club entitled "Deustchland ist Wunderbar!!" here comes my 3 day ban...

p.p.s.-can i help roll the stone away from timmytut's forum grave when he returns?

[timmytuttut88]

There is a clear line, despite the thread starters opinion. My age, for example, is private to anyone I want it to be. So is my location (precise), my living arrangements, my public messengers, my full name, my current bank provider, etc. However, my gender is nothing that cannot be identified with half the planet, nor is my (general) location (go Pack go <_<), my IRC channels.

That's exactly what we want. I just got a three day ban for ,apparently, having the title of someones essay in my sig. It didn't say "THIS IS (USERNAMES) ESSAY COME READ IT". It was just the title and it didn't say who's essay it was.

There are obvious, common sense no-no's on the internet; and yet, people keep ignoring them, taking the rules word for word, and attempting to use it against other users. And now DaGip and the Bullet-Proof-Bandits (wfe you call yourselves), are getting super pissy when it comes back to bite you in the ass.

First off, if you're going to start flaming, take it to FW and i'll serve your ass on a plate faster the you can say the word "go". I also find it weird how the mods blame us for not understanding the rules. They should be explaining the rules, not banning us for not understanding them.

Also please respond to my earlier question. If someone called me "timmy", would that warrant a ban because that is my first name?

[Kotaro]

That's exactly what we want. I just got a three day ban for ,apparently, having the title of someones essay in my sig. It didn't say "THIS IS (USERNAMES) ESSAY COME READ IT". It was just the title and it didn't say who's essay it was.

First off, if you're going to start flaming, take it to FW and i'll serve your ass on a plate faster the you can say the word "go". I also find it weird how the mods blame us for not understanding the rules. They should be explaining the rules, not banning us for not understanding them.

Also please respond to my earlier question. If someone called me "timmy", would that warrant a ban because that is my first name?

Flaming? I see no flames. Do you deny that "Bandits" were pissy over their ban? That they took it lying down, said nothing? Or did they get pissy at the mods (oddly enough, not at the user that was the obvious cause of everything), and start posting threads about how pissed they were? It seems that you're the one flame-baiting, and there are no flames going on here.

Now, I'm saying the rules are general rules, that need common sense to understand. And before you jump on your "I'm so superior and you're flaming me" wambulance, I'm not insinuating that you users have no common sense; I'm stating that, since these rules have come out, you're purposely disregarding it, to use it for your own gain. And it's biting you in the ass. So sorry I don't feel too bad for you, but... Well, I don't.

Oh, and,

Perhaps. It would also warrant a ban for you, since you seem to like extreme measures, because you posted personal information in your username.

There you go, a 2nd time.

Wow, that was a wall of text, and not very interesting, I might add. Run on sentences and everything else HS teachers say are a "no-no". And I should know; I'm studying to be one.

Now, as for a reply. First off, each member that has posted their own image, has done so of their own choice, as is signified by their posting it, and claiming it as their own. However, no one ever signified that they wanted, or even were a part of, choosing their images in that signature. And every user put that signature up, which showed other users pictures. In this case, that allowed for several users to go around, spreading the personal information of every other member that was in there, wherever they wanted. So, to paraphrase;
Posting your own personal information = Okay.
Posting someone elses personal information = Not Okay.

Also, for someone that cares so much about the rules, you go around rambling about "Black Jesus" and how you are him, which is a basic bitch-slap insult to any and all Christians; not because you claim Jesus is black, but you claim you are him. And, to use a Christian like teaching (modified, of course), than "Every rule is an equal rule, and as such, the punishment is the same."

[owenshooter]

Wow, that was a wall of text, and not very interesting, I might add. Run on sentences and everything else HS teachers say are a "no-no". And I should know; I'm studying to be one.

since english is my third language, do you mind translating your response in either german or spanish, my 2 native tongues? thank you... oh, you used the semi-colon incorrectly... even i know that. and now onto your absurd response:

Now, as for a reply. First off, each member that has posted their own image, has done so of their own choice, as is signified by their posting it, and claiming it as their own. However, no one ever signified that they wanted, or even were a part of, choosing their images in that signature. And every user put that signature up, which showed other users pictures. In this case, that allowed for several users to go around, spreading the personal information of every other member that was in there, wherever they wanted.

mmmm, no, that is incorrect. each member, when they are admitted into the clan, choose an image to be used in the sig. some choose real life pictures (me, fwblb, brett at one point, daydream, nagerous), others choose their avatars (superrag, happy2seeyou, acyckowski). so, each and every member has chosen the image within the sig to represent them. nice try, matlock, but you are wrong... the info posted within the clan sig is chosen by each individual member and can be changed at any time they so choose to do so...-0

[Kotaro]

since english is my third language, do you mind translating your response in either german or spanish, my 2 native tongues? thank you... the black jesus has spoken...-0

p.s.-you used the semi-colon incorrectly... even i know that.

I could translate into German, if you would like, but I don't speak McDon... I mean Spanish, very well, since I haven't been to any fast food places in a few weeks. My apologies.

And I've learned a great deal about the semi-colon since I've started college. The first rule of the semi-colon is, ignore everything taught in high school about it. The same goes for the comma, the colon, and the long dash.

[Artimis]

I think it's funny that we cannot post personal information that is already posted on every users profile. What country we live in is posted, yet Twill states that we are not allowed to mention it. Letting everyone know what country we are from is not an option we are given. CC is broadcasting that "personal information". Once broadcasted by CC, it's no longer "personal".

Also on each and every profile is the option to list the following: "Location", "Occupation", and "Interests".

Agreed, once a user discloses personal information in the public domain, it becomes public property. It is the responsibility of the subject to make sure that sensitive personal information is not disclosed. If they are unwise enough to do so then I have no sympathy for them and they should not have any recourse what so ever.

[owenshooter]

Agreed, once a user discloses personal information in the public domain, it becomes public property. It is the responsibility of the subject to make sure that sensitive personal information is not disclosed. If they are unwise enough to do so then I have no sympathy for them and they should not have any recourse what so ever.

exactly... agree 100%... with the exception of other users using that info in the public domain to flame other members in the forums, that is crossing a line. for instance, scrawling "cock muncher" on someones personal image that they use as an avatar would be an obvious personal info policy violation (yes, believe it or not, this has occured). but if i'm in a clan and i choose to use my photo as my avatar in a clan sig, i should be able to do so, and all members should be able to have the sig. i think common sense needs to prevail here, and it just isn't happening. nice post, mr. artimis... the black jesus has spoken..-0

[lancehoch]

timmytuttut88, calling you timmy is not using personal information. Your username is long and has numbers at the end and is thus harder to remember. By calling you timmy, people are referring to your username. If someone said Timmy, that is potentially different, since a capitalization refers to a name instead of a username, however it can be assumed that your name is Timmy from your username just like it can be assumed that my name is Lance and that owenshooter's name is Owen. Whether this is true is irrelevant, but if people feel like calling me lancehoch, lance, or Lance that is not personal information. If someone said lancehoch is actually this person named Lance XXXXX who lives XXXXX, does XXXXX in his private time, and likes XXXXX. That is using personal information.

[deliaselene]

following a incident involving the lion and firth some months ago, Twill posted the following thread regarding this issue...

Using personal info in flames

Postby Twill » Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:05 pm
Using personal information, including names, addresses, pictures, blogs or anything else identifiable in a flame, is considered trolling and that makes it one of the few no nos of the forum guidelines.

You are free to flame an online character, but as soon as that flaming becomes of a real person it crosses a line. Once a flame crosses that line, I get to have fun

This includes information voluntarily posted anywhere on CC or dug up somewhere else on the interweb. It's their life, let them have it.

Any and all future flames which involve personal information will be fair game for placing the poster on a forum vacation.

Have a toasty one
Twill

[hecter]

Again, another example of users acting like complete idiots because they are upset. Everyone knows what is personal information, and what isn't. There is a clear line, despite the thread starters opinion. My age, for example, is private to anyone I want it to be. So is my location (precise), my living arrangements, my public messengers, my full name, my current bank provider, etc. However, my gender is nothing that cannot be identified with half the planet, nor is my (general) location (go Pack go <_<), my IRC channels.

There are obvious, common sense no-no's on the internet; and yet, people keep ignoring them, taking the rules word for word, and attempting to use it against other users. And now DaGip and the Bullet-Proof-Bandits (wfe you call yourselves), are getting super pissy when it comes back to bite you in the ass.

If you want the rule used literally, word for word, than you will have it like it has been, with entire clans being banned at a time without warning. However, if you people ever feel like growing up, pretending to be mature, and using common sense, than the rule won't be so harsh.

If only it was that simple. I can name a few cases where people have been warned for posting personal information when they weren't being all pissy and demanding that the rule be used literally and whatnot.

[jbrettlip]

Any chance of some feedback on my post, Mr. twill?

sure, just hadn't gotten there yet.

twill,

LFAW's sig is a picture of SOMEBODY, unless LFAW is two people. I know you did this to "punish" Owen, or show him who is boss, but really as I stated before, the intent should be looked at, not the actual usage. There is personal info all over this forum...hell I have SEEN Obama's birth certificate on this forum. Why don't you reword your rule, to actually encompass what you are trying to accomplish? Otherwise, every quote, every topic about politics, religion, music, and sports would have to dissappear. I don't think that is what you originally intended, so I ask you to take this suggestion under consideration.

Again, you're taking the rule too far. The wording of the rule (in 2 places in the community guidelines) is this:

Don't ever post personal information of other users. Anywhere. Ever. Even if they already posted it somewhere else. This includes posting personal information about a CC user on another site, you will be held accountable here.

# Attacking a person instead of the user is NOT ok - it's all fun and games until it becomes personal.

* Using a person's real information, picture, address, blog or anything else "personal" is NOT ok.

Both places it refers to the personal information of people who are users on this site. If you are quoting, reposting or otherwise using content that was created by a user, then that's fine - it does not link back to the person using that account and the two lives can be kept separate. However, if you post anything about the person who controls that user, that implicitly or explicitly links a real person to a fictitious user, then you have crossed a line.

Obama's birth certificate doesn't fall under this rule because, sadly, Obama doesn't have an account here (that I know of). The two people in LFAW's sig are, probably, not users here, and even if they are, that image is completely anonymous.

I'd argue that Owen's "photo" is not even personal info because it would be virtually impossible to identify owen in a crowd from that image because it has been manipulated so far and has no reference point on the site with which to link it to an actual photograph of him - but then, would Owen really have accepted that as an acceptable outcome? No, because he didn't accept it when Gip changed his avatar, he still wanted the ban.

The rule is very clearly stated, and intended, to prevent users from posting any content, with or without permission, that could link a user to a person. Every person who uses this site has the right to be in direct control of their own information at all times, as soon as it is in the hands of another person, it is out of their direct control.

Eagerly awaiting your snarky, if you don't like the forum google.com can help you find another one, response.

But it's oh so true. especially when you give me the equally snarky "but this information is on google!" remarks.

Any chance of some feedback on my post, Mr. twill?

PLease read the exchange that Twill and I had in C&A forum when this all came about. Kotaro, this is the difference in user /real people that I am citing. HE says it is the way the rule should work, and then HE used it in a different way on TImmytutut88. I am not discussing the BpB sig Krystallnacht Zwei. I am discussing the community mod abusing powers.

If you know all about high school english, why are you studying to be a teacher? AHHHHHH, BAN ME!!!!!!